Wow, four pages on a crazy play that happened to me! Thanks to all that posted for the insights. Using Tony's last post as a summary here are my current thoughts on the play:
Quote:
Originally posted by BktBallRef
A try starts when the player begins the motion which habitually precedes the release of the ball. If the ball is slapped away by a defender after the motion has begun, YES SIR, IT IS A BLOCKED SHOT. There is no question about that.
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Tony, I agree with all of this. However, it all occurs with team control. So, we have only shown that you can have a try and a blocked shot during team control.
Quote:
Originally posted by BktBallRef
If there was a foul, wouldn't you give the shooter two FTs?
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Sure, you can be fouled in the act of shooting and during team control! And even while "on the floor!"
Therefore, I should have used more precise language in my original post. I should have written "thinking team control ended with the blocked shot, I let play continue."
Now I believe that the try and the block occurred during team control since the ball had not been released by the shooter, and that it was a backcourt violation.
I base my belief on the following reasoning:
How do I know that the shooter didn't change his mind at the last moment and was intending to fire a pass to a teammate under the basket when the ball was swatted from his hands?
We all agree that if a player is passing to a teammate and the ball is slapped out of his hands team control still exists. However, since we cannot read the player's minds, what their intent is (to shoot or to pass) has to be irrelavent.
This leaves us with the problem of determining exactly when this try ends. I think that Lotto has come closest to my view, when he said the try ended with the block. I now have to support this with the wording of the rule in 4-40.
Article 2 says in part, "A try for field goal is
an attempt by a player to score two or three points
by throwing the ball into a team's own basket."
Part of Article 4 tells us that the try ends "when it is certain
the throw is unsuccessful."
I have focused on the parts in bold because they stress that the attempt to score must be due to a throw by the offensive player. If the player is prevented from throwing the ball in an attempt to score, it is logical to conclude that it is certain that his try will be unsuccessful (unless it is an attempted dunk!). Hence, my understanding of this rule is that if the flight of the ball is not due to the offensive player throwing it, it no longer qualifies as part of a try! "THE THROW" simply never took place.
Since the flight of the ball on this play is the result of a bat by a defensive player and not a throw by an offensive player, we do not have the ball "in flight during a try," (4-12-3) and thus team control continues.
Note that this understanding also nicely handles Chuck's twist about the direction that the batted ball goes. It doesn't matter, it is not a throw by the offensive player, no matter which way it goes it is not a try.