Constant Debate - Vertical Plane

NCHSAA

BktBallRef wrote
Do you look at what the rule book says about a situation before you post it?
In this play, the rule is clear.

4-23-3c
After the initial legal guarding position is obtained:
The guard may move laterally or obliquely to maintain position, provided it is not toward the opponent when contact occurs.

If the defender is moving toward the opponent with the ball when the contact occurs, the foul is on the defender. Who initiated the contact is of no consequence, by rule.

The shooter can jump 10 feet forward if he chooses to. It's not a foul unless the contact is against a defender with legal position.

No can't say that I do 😉! I can see the call if it is a regular shot, but a "heev ho" where the offensive player is turned and the contact is on the shoulder, I cannot. Dwayne Wade had a couple of plays like this that I can think of, where he would get the defender to jump forward then he would turn sideways and jump into the defender just to cause the contact, this is the type situation I am trying to describe.

BktBallRef

NCHSAA wrote
No can't say that I do 😉! I can see the call if it is a regular shot, but a "heev ho" where the offensive player is turned and the contact is on the shoulder, I cannot. Dwayne Wade had a couple of plays like this that I can think of, where he would get the defender to jump forward then he would turn sideways and jump into the defender just to cause the contact, this is the type situation I am trying to describe.

Where in the OP did you say you were talking about a "heev ho?" 🙂

Is contact on a shooter's shoulder normally a foul?

Why would that make a difference?

NCHSAA

BktBallRef wrote
Where in the OP did you say you were talking about a "heev ho?" 🙂

Is contact on a shooter's shoulder normally a foul?

Why would that make a difference?

Where in the OP did you say you were talking about a "heev ho?" 🙂

"offensive player created contact also, if not first"///"offensive player jumped forward into the defense trying to get the call"

Is contact on a shooter's shoulder normally a foul?

Yes, but I like the term normally

APG

Again, if a defensive player is moving towards an offensive player, the burden is on the defense...even if the offensive player jumps towards the defender. This is no different than say a dribbler moving towards a defender who is moving forward toward him. This doesn't give the offensive player carte blanche to do whatever because you can still go offensive if it's clear the defender jumps clear to the side offensive player or he does something overt (leads with an elbow, foot, or anything else non basketball related).

Adam

There's nothing in the rules which prevents a player from bracing for contact; even if that player is also trying to shoot.

twocentsworth

if defender has LGP = no foul on defender.
if defender does not have LGP (either never had it or has not maintained it) = foul on defender.

as officials, the more we break things down to "keep it simple", the more accurate we become.

ontheway

IVERSON does it all the time he jumps anyway he can into defenders and i personally know guys who wont give him the call if a defender is at fault hes at fault its pretty clear

cmcramer

Same play I posted years ago. Foul on defense. Thank you BktBallRef and others who posted the rule and supported it:

"In this play, the rule is clear.

4-23-3c
After the initial legal guarding position is obtained:
The guard may move laterally or obliquely to maintain position, provided it is not toward the opponent when contact occurs."

http://forum.officiating.com/basketball/30273-up-under-move.html

Raymond

ontheway wrote
IVERSON does it all the time he jumps anyway he can into defenders and i personally know guys who wont give him the call if a defender is at fault hes at fault its pretty clear

"Does it all the time"? When's the last time anybody has seen AI play? LOL

APG

ontheway wrote
IVERSON does it all the time he jumps anyway he can into defenders and i personally know guys who wont give him the call if a defender is at fault hes at fault its pretty clear

On a side note, I'm not sure if English is your second language and if so, disregard this, but it would help immensely if you improved your grammar. Proper capitalization and punctuation really will help get your point across. I find I have to read your posts 2-3 times before I get the gist of it.

Raymond

AllPurposeGamer wrote
On a side note, I'm not sure if English is your second language and if so, disregard this, but it would help immensely if you improved your grammar. Proper capitalization and punctuation really will help get your point across. I find I have to read your posts 2-3 times before I get the gist of it.

Oh, then maybe he was watching AI play recently. Maybe he is from Turkey. 😀