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Originally Posted by blueit
It may well be my last post. This will be my last on this topic.
We've got a rule that doesn't say immediate or delayed dead ball (for the tag that makes no safe-out difference).
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Yes, it does. I challenge you to cite the rule that even brings it into question. I reiterate, "a rule", not a TWP scenario.
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We've got a comment that specifically says call dead ball at the end of the play, not upon the non-event tag. And we end up awarding bases or protection to runners not affected by the obstruction. None of those things seem to bother anyone here.
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That is because we read the rules, attend/conduct clinics and schools and study interpretations provided by the powers that be. You are debating a rule that is explicitly clear as to the status of the ball.
The ONLY question is that which started this thread of where to place runners between bases when the ball, BY RULE, is declared dead. You have been given opinion, interpretation and rule applications as to how this situation can be handled.
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Evidently it's too much of a threat to the "this is how we call it" mindset
to even acknowledge that the rule is incomplete or the comment is wrong,
not to mention explore the WHY of whether a meaningless tag should kill further action. I was hoping for some real objective, 'big picture' discussion of why this SHOULD be called as it apparently is, and at least an acknowledgment that both the rule and comment need some improvement or (as to the comment) deletion.
Instead, it's just, over and over, "of course it's an immediate dead ball ... because that's how we call it."
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NO, IT IS AN IMMEDIATE DEAD BALL
BECAUSE THE RULE SAYS SO!!!
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I've taken an informal poll among 3-4 of the younger umps in our group & several of the old timers. The former group, after I've explained "how it's called", despite the casebook comment, was unanimous that "That doesn't make much sense." The latter group's reaction was, "That's how it's always been called," and they don't really want to think about whether it really makes sense or not -- that's just the way it is. It's apparent which group predominates here.
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Then your group has either received some pretty poor training or you haven't been paying attention.....sorta like in this thread.