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Originally Posted by just another ref
My whole argument is not based on a case play, but on the definition of a dribble: a player.......pushes the ball to the floor once or several times.
When the ball hits the floor, that can be considered a dribble whether it touches the player's hand again or not. What it the defender slaps the ball out of bounds on its return flight straight up toward the illegal dribbler's hand?
You gonna give the ball back to the offense, citing "That might have been a pass."
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That's a legitimate question. That and what if the defender fouls the offensive player during this same time frame (the time between after the ball has struck the floor, but prior to the offensive player touching it again)?
Certainly there is a need to know the exact point at which the violation occurs. The case play which you have cited provides the best clarification which I have seen. Of course, player control is of primary concern. If at any point the official deems that player control has ceased, then there is no longer a dribbler.
I can create a scenario in which a player who has already dribbled tosses the ball out in front of him several feet and then takes off after it, but before reaching it an opponent fouls this player. What should an official do?