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Originally Posted by M&M Guy
Huh? What in the Clarification am I mis-reading?  Where am I saying there is judgment needed? I thought I was saying just the opposite - any pass, throw, or shot that originates from outside the arc counts as 3 points if it goes in the basket, even if it touches a defender that happens to be within the arc. There is no judgment at all as to whether a "try" has occurred. |
Then explain this:
4.41.4 SITUATION B: A1's three-point try is short and below ring level when it hits the shoulder of: (a) A2; or (b) B1 and rebounds to the backboard and through the basket. RULING: The three-point try ended when it was obviously short and below the ring. However, since a live ball went through the basket, two points are scored in both (a) and (b). (5-1)
This says that if it is a try that falls short and is deflected into the basket it is only two points. There is no ambiguity...it is a two. You can't ignore that. You are saying that if it were not a try but a pass or thrown ball, that it would be three points with the exact same deflection. You have to decide if it was a try or not... judgment required (under your interpretation). Unless you're going to completely ignore 4.41.4b when a try fall short and is tipped in by a defender.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by M&M Guy
You, Nevada, and bz are adding the assumption that the thrown ball has characteristics of a shot or try - has to be "thrown towards the basket", "if it's below the rim when it's contacted it would only be 2 points", "if it's on it's downward flight it must be GT", and so on. The Clarification specifically adds the word "pass" to it, which tells me 3 points can be scored on a pass, which does not carry the characteristics of a shot.
So, is this statement true: "Any pass that originates from outside the arc, and is tipped by the defense inside the arc, and goes through the basket, counts as 3 points"? According to the 5-2-1, the case play, and the Clarification, it is. And, as well, the OP.
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NO, it is not always true (but sometimes is). Given that 4.41.4 is unambiguous and the clarifying comment gives the indication that the they are to be scored the same without regard to whether it is a try or a pass, it can only be a two unless it left the throwers hands in such a way that it could have gone in without the defender's involvement.
Let's try this a different way...
A ball, as it leaves a throwers hands either as a pass or a try. The moment it leaves the hands, it either has a chance of going in or it doesn't. If it does, it will 3 if it originated from behind the line. If it doesn't, the amount to score is not a relevant question. Should a defender get involved in the play, the touching by the defender doesn't change the status of the ball with regards to the amount scored. If the ball was not on a potentially scoring trajectory...a 0 point trajectory...the scoring opportunity for that throw is over, it can not become a 3 by the defense directing the ball into the basket. Any new direction that takes the ball on a path towards the basket is a new action.