Quote:
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Originally Posted by bob jenkins
A ball is loose on the floor. A1 dives for the ball and grasps it with two hands. B1 dives for the ball (without contacting A1) and manages to place one hand on the ball. THis often results in a held ball.
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And it often gets called incorrectly too. I don't know how many times I've seen a player reach for the ball and just touch it, then look at me waiting for the whistle.
Even if you want to read into hands as meaning any combination between opponents of 2-4, the rule still states
FIRMLY and
UNDUE ROUGHNESS to gain control.
Most times when the ball is on the floor we aren't talking about just a hand contacting the ball, it's usually hand, wrist and arm as well.
In the original post I see noway that B1 could get into a position coming from behind, and over the shoulder, to get a firm grasp on the ball. My partner and I tried it in the dressing room before our game last night, and I even stood on a bench to add a nearly 2 foot height difference, and it's impossible.
The human arm does bend enough to reach over and under, and grasp the ball without contact. You can't grasp the ball firmly from that position, and it wouldn't take undue roughness to get sole control by A1.
Common sense tells me what actually would occur in the OP is B1 makes the move for the ball. His chest is contacting A1's back, and the back of his arm is contacting A1's chest. Not hearing a whistle, A1 pulls his arms in, pinning B1's arm in the process, and thus making the contact more noticeable. Still not hearing a whistle A1 decides to get B1 off him by doing the little judo move.
This is a lot of things, but a held ball it isn't.