Quote:
Originally posted by Slider
I must disagree with the consensus. For whatever perverse reason, live ball contact by players is only called as a personal. If he swung his elbows excessively before contact (and you recognized that), then you could have a T.
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It's a T to swing the elbows excessively. When the elbows swing, you have a T immediately. You don't go with a lesser penalty because there's contact. The contact is not the foul. The act of swining the elbows is the foul, although it is technical, not personal.
With regards to fighting, I will always call falgrant technicals for fighting. Fighting occurs when the player swings, not when he makes contact. It's fighting whether he makes contact or not.
In the case of fighting, it's not really as important because the penalty is basically the same. But with regards to swinging the elbows, it's simply wrong to only call a personal just because there's contact, when you would call a T if there wasn't contact. The rule book says it's a T, even if there isn't any contact, not only if their isn't contact.