[Bainer]

I think if this argument is to continue (please, God, no!), there does need to be a small clarification made.

There is a marked difference between a ball RISING and ball MOVING VERTICALLY.

Firing a baseball into the roof of my living room is not a rising fastball, though by many of your definitions, it simply rose until it reached it's target.

The mythical 'Rising Fastball' is purported to change it's angle of incidence- much like a curveball or sinker- though obviously not to such a great extent. It would begin on one trajectory arc, and finish on another.

The arguements being made about submarine pitchers or fastpitch pitchers is invalid- the ball doesn't RISE- it is thrown UPWARDS.

It's a difficult concept- especially for us dumb-a$$ umpires, but it's about relative planes.

-the line from the pitcher's hand to the catcher's glove is not straight- it is arced, though accepted as 'normal'. Now, a reduction of that arc is simply a reduction- not a rise. For a rise to occur, the ball would have to achieve a position which falls between it's initial release point and lowest point- ie, drop and come back up- or RISE.

Anyway, I'm already bored of this- reading this thread has taken hours off of my life!

Just remember, if you define RISE simply as going up, then any 8-11 yr old who slams one off the backstop has achieved the impossible!


Bainer.