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Originally posted by cmathews
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Originally posted by blindzebra
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Originally posted by cmathews
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Originally posted by BktBallRef
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Originally posted by FrankHtown
What would we do in the case of A1 fouls B1, and simultaneously B2 curses A2?...An intentional foul, like a technical foul, carries its own penalty...
Would we just go to POI??????
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Okay, work with me on this and see if you agree with the logic:
A personal foul by A1 against B1 and a technical foul by by B1 against A1 would not be considered a double foul, as the rule book refers a double technical or a double personal. The rule book does not define a personal foul and a technical foul, committed by opponents against each other as a double foul.
The way I read it, the only difference in double fouls and simultaneous fouls is that simultaneous fouls are not committed against by two opponents against each other.
Therefore, I would treat it as a false double foul and rule that you would shoot FTs as what you describe would not meet the definition of simultaneous fouls. Since the fouls will probably be called by different officials, you should have room to rule that one came after the other. You could possibly do this in the original situation as well.
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BBR I would agree except for one item. The simultaneous foul definition says "A simultaneous foul (personal or technical)....."
With that in mind I think that the originl situation would be a simultaneous foul since that definition doesn't break them out individually like the double fould definition does...however I am thinking that you could correctly "assume" that one occured before the other and now make it a false double....or better yet "make" one occur before the other.
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That does not mean a combination of personal and technical but two of either.
A1 fouls B1 and B2 fouls A2 or A1 gets a T for calling one official a doody head at the same time B2 gets a T for saying it to another official.
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I humbly disagree and this is why. We already have definitions of double fouls and double technicals. I believe that the parenthesis indicate that either/or or a combination of the two. If it weren't meant to be this way then there would be no need for a simultaneous fould definition, because the situation would fit nicely into the definition of a double foul or a false double foul. IMHO
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DF or DTF are committed by players on both teams against each other. SF fouls are fouls committed by both teams at the same time, but not player against player, and that is the difference between the two.
The rule is clearly intended as simultaneous personal or technicals and not one personal and one technical.