Quote:
Originally posted by mcrowder
I'm not missing your point. I'm trying to get you to think it through, but I'm failing.
Let me ask it this way - what rule in FED tells you to call the batter out for entering the dugout after a base on balls? Quote it if necessary.
And don't confuse Abandonment with Desertion. Abandonment cannot be called on a BR who has not yet reached first base... so by what rule are you calling BR out if he enters the dugout on, say, a dropped pop fly to CF?
Also, I will ask this, in effort to steer...
If you are calling the BR out for stepping into the dugout on a dropped pop fly to CF, why could the runners not return? (And if your answer is that they could... then obviously there's no force). Conversely, if you are keeping the force in play, then how do you justify calling the BR out for entering the dugout (or... would you let BR leave his dugout to go to 1st base after seeing CF drop the ball?) You can't have it both ways.
|
I think you've hit the nail on the head as far as the dilemma this problem presents for the umpire.
I don't think you can support it (by rule) either way.
Rick Roder has an interesting book that I read a while back entitled "More Than 100 Problems With The Official Baseball Rules". So, quite clearly, not everything is covered in the rules and, worse yet, not everything is necessarily covered by an Official Interpretation. Some things are not even covered very well by an Authoritative Opinion.
This may be one of those awkward cases.
It seems to me that the best way to handle this might be as follows.
The force plays stay intact with total disregard as to WHEN the BR enters the dugout. If the defense continues to make a play on the BR, by touching the bag, then the BR is out in the normal fashion and the umpire doesn't have to be concerned with any of these complications.
If the defense fails to make a play on the BR, and the BR belatedly makes a beeline for the bag, the play should be allowed because, clearly, the defense has had their chance and has failed to make a logical play against the BR. If the BR arrives before the bag is touched - he's safe! The BR has gained no advantage by belatedly going for the bag from the dugout. The defense has simply failed to make a logical play.
If the defense fails to make a play on the BR, and the BR remains in the dugout and all action has ceased - the umpire should NOW interpret this as desertion and the BR is now OUT regardless of any subsequent action. The BR has had ample time to realize his mistake and has failed to take action and is no longer given the opportunity to rectify his mistake.
Again, this is based on nothing more than MY OPINION of what might seem a logical and fair way to handle this but I am hardly anyone who can offer an Authoritative Opinion.
In other words, it's MY opinion ... not an AUTHORITATIVE opinion. :-)
My logic is this: The penalty for desertion can be delayed until all continuous action has ceased and the BR, by his
lack of action, has made it clear he has no intention of advancing to 1st. At *that* time he forfeits his opportunity to rectify his mistake.
This way of handling it is somewhat consistent with the delayed nature of calling abandonment. Although the RULE states that the runner has to merely leave the baseline and demonstrate no desire to advance on the bases - if I recall correctly (and I could be wrong), the Authoritative Opinion on abandonment has a somewhat higher standard of what constitutes sufficient abandonment to warrant calling the runner out. In practice, the umpire should require the runner to leave the field of play, or, be a "substantial" distance from his position on the basepaths before declaring him out - as opposed to merely "out of the baseline."
Somebody please correct me if I'm wrong about this Authoritative Opinion. I could be.
David Emerling
Memphis, TN