[M&M Guy]

Originally posted by rainmaker
It's so tempting to apply simplistic answers, as you say you are inclined to do. I understand that urge, I really do. Complications involve thought, thought, experimentation, more thought, failure, more thought, introspection, discussion and more thought. It's easy to say "they should..." and easy to feel that there's a one size fits all answer.

Unfortunately, life just isn't like that.

Exactly. Isn't that what the NCAA is doing? The "one size fits all" answer of saying Indian mascots are wrong. What thought, introspection, discussion, etc. went into the decision that these specific mascots were "hostile and abusive"? Was it the view of a few, or the result of a consensus of the many?

Originally posted by rainmaker
You're right about "the victim mentality" being over-used in our culture today, but that doesn't mean that there aren't true victims. My point still holds that there are people who are true victims of racism, and that they will need the help of others to help them "get over it." Part of that help should include the cooperation of others in not adding to the victimization.

Agreed. I hope I've never implied the problem has gone away. But, who gets to decide who are the true victims and who aren't?

Originally posted by rainmaker
Racism isn't just when I intend to hurt you or judge you based on race. It's also the structure of society that's set up to perpetuate a class system based on race.

This is where I disagree; not with the general idea, but with the implication that our current society is set up that way. It seems as though the argument starts to to depend on "leap of faith" logic to make the point. Racism is still, IMO, in terminology used on this board before, based on advantage/disadvantage. Did one race/heritage/skin color unfairly benfit at the expense of another race/heritage/skin color? In the past, that was certainly the case. But what about now? What specific examples of policies or laws in this country are directly responsible for holding back certain races?

Originally posted by rainmaker
I don't care who built the wall. And I don't care whose job it is to tear it down. I have friends, loved ones and neighbors on the other side, and I intend to do everything I can to see that it is severely damaged in my lifetime. If you would join me, it would go a lot faster.

Instead of blaming the folks over there, let's just get the darn thing demolished! Then it will be easier to see how much is caused by the victim mentality, and how much really is true victimization.

This is a great idea, in theory. How can anyone with any rational thought process disagree? But I'm not sure it's a practical roadmap to a solution. Sure, we can say we are going to tear down that damn wall. But what if the "non-victim" victims don't want it torn down? If it is, they would have to take personal reponsibilty for their position in life, rather than being able to blame someone else, or society. Many of the bricks have indeed disappeared over time; that is why things like slavery have disappeared in this country. And, as more people become enlightened, more bricks will disappear. But making the entire wall vanish will be the hardest, because human nature dictates that some people don't want the wall gone.