Quote:
Originally posted by Jurassic Referee
Quote:
Originally posted by Daryl H. Long
Quote:
Originally posted by Jurassic Referee
Quote:
Originally posted by Daryl H. Long
For Situation 3:
In Fed it is an immediate dead ball when the dribbler, even while not touching the ball, steps outof bounds. Rule 9-3.
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Even if the player realizes that he stepped on the OOB line, and is then smart enough not to touch the ball again after doing so? Is he still a dribbler then or has he ended or interrupted that dribble? It's not a violation to step OOB after a dribble ends or during an interrupted dribble(as in R4-15-6d), is it?
Enquiring minds need to know! 
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To apply 9-3 there must be player control. The penalty Section of 9-3 says the ball is dead when the violation occurs. The Note in 9-3 say the violation occurs when the dribbler steps on or outside a boundary. Therefore the violation occurs whether or not he subsequently touches the ball or not. (In NCAA if he was smart enough to realize and does not touch the ball afterwards then no violation).
9-3 does not apply if there is no player control. This includes interrupted dribble (4-15-6d) and during a fumble. I assumed you were meant to say there was a fumble after the dribble ended in your last question. There is no player control in either case (4-15-5, and 4-15-4 Note 2).
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Exactly and I agree completely with that. However, to apply R9-3, you do need player control, as you stated yourself. If the player gives up that control before touching the ball again, there is no way you can now apply R9-3 without that player touching the ball again immediately. Right? Iow, the violation occurs when the player immediately touches the ball during the course of his dribble after stepping OOB, but there is no violation if he interrupts or abandons that dribble after stepping OOB- because the interrupted or abandoned dribble no longer meets the criteria of R9-3, but now meets the criteria of R4-15-6d instead.
Note that this is a discussion that we've had before, usually with Camron Rust-who agrees completely with you. In real life, the dribbler is not gonna be smart enough to let the ball go after stepping OOB. He's just gonna continue dribbling, and it's gonna be a bang-bang violation call anyway.
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Actually I'm the one that went round and round with you on this issue.
The intent of an interrupted dribble is to not penalize for an ACCIDENTAL loss of control. To me if the ball is not AWAY from the dribbler BEFORE they step OOB it's a violation. It's also a violation when they step OOB and not when they touch it again.
Keep in mind that EVERY dribble is away from the dribbler, so by rule, are we to judge that A1 is not in control when the ball is not touching their hand?
