Sat Mar 03, 2001, 02:00pm
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Official Forum Member
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Join Date: Jan 2001
Posts: 220
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Running Over Boy Scouts
Quote:
Originally posted by Rog
.....still not convienced, perhaps because of the situation more than the rules.
Coaches being out of the box and down the lines is an age old issue. One that is ignored unless an opposing coach bellyaches.
In your situation the coach came out of the box and down the line sometime before R1 ever reached 3rd, much less turned the corner (and headed for home?, we don't know this for a fact, perhaps R1 would have just turned and stopped).
Because of where the coach set up down the line it seems more likely that he was in fact just trying to get R1 to hold up at 3rd base.
The coach made no overt act of stopping R3, he just stood there, with his hands in the air and got plowed into. Sorry, but I just don't see any coach just standing there and - taking one for the team. Not without at least putting his hands done in an attempt to protect himself, or stymie the force of R3. (jmo, and it is a judgement call after all)
Quote:
Originally posted by Jim Porter
Quote:
Originally posted by Rog
.....I've got to humble disagree with you on this one. I have R1 safe at 3rd.
Why, because according to:
"J/R - Part III #13 Offensive Interference, Section IV:
[It is interference if a coach]
(3) physically assists a runner's advance or return to a base.
Penalty: such runner is out but the ball remains live. 7.09i
* OBR 7.09(i) In the judgement of the umpire, the base coach at third base, or first base, by touching or holding the runner, physically assists him in returning to or leaving third base or first base.
Both sections seem clear in the aspect of:
physically assists a runner's advance, returning or leaving.
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Rog,
The coach in my situation clearly assisted the runner in returning to third base. The runner wasn't going to return. Instead, the runner was going on home where he probably would have been put out.
But the coach, by physically touching him (can't get much more of a physical touch than a collision,) stopped him from continuing home and getting put out. The coach's actions prevented the runner from being put out at home, and as a result, the runner safely returned to third with the coach's assistance.
I know what you think assistance means. We get the image of a Boy Scout aiding an old person across a busy street, or we think of Welfare and other public assistance programs. But that's not what it means here. Here, it means anything which aids or helps the runner, or gives him an advantage.
I also believe you may be misinterpreting the part about "returning to or leaving" third base. That part of the rule is there to ensure that an umpire understands that, not only can a coach not aid, help, or lend advantage to a runner in advancing, he cannot help him in returning either. It implies nothing further than that. Think about it, a runner can only be returning to or leaving third base - - there are no other possibilities.
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Actually I didn't read the play very carefully and didn't concentrate on Jim Porter's answer. I've got to say I lean with Rog on this play. A coach who has to prevent a runner from attempting to score on such a play by merely being in his path lends little meaningful assistance if a collision results in which both player and coach fall to the ground. With the proper cutoff that runner should still be thrown out at 3B.
I think you could rule the coach interfered especially if the coach alters his natural stance. However, if the player with his head down rounds the bag rather than cutting it and collides with his coach I think that may be enough punishment. If you see the coach adjust his position to cause the collision you could call it. I'd say that would be tough if the coach never raises his hands even to protect himself. Some runners "make up their minds" absent what a coach might be saying or signaling. Jim Simms/NYC
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