Quote:
Originally posted by jeffpea
Nevadaref -- Using your logic, if the same scenario occurred after time expired in the 4th quarter and the officials did the same thing (mistakenly administered the technical FT's before the 1 minute "intermission" prior to the beginning of overtime), would the made FT's count towards the score in the 4th quarter? Of course not. Those points would count towards the overtime period. The officials would still administer the throw-in penalty to start the over-time period.
The only situation that applies, using your thought process, is if you had a foul on a shot that was released before the clock expired at the end of the quarter and needed to shoot FT's. Then you have a T before you administer the FT's (remember the quarter has not ended until all FT's or penalties are administered). You would shoot the common foul FT(s), then the T FT's. The quarter has then ended and you cannot carry the throw-in penalty to the next period, so you go to AP arrow.
Does that make sense to you?
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Jeff,
Did you read the whole thread? This argument has nothing to do with the either JR's or my understanding of what the rules are. We agree on that. What we don't agree upon is in which quarter the FTs were actually shot. We both clearly agree upon what should have been done.
Now to your own rules knowledge. First read 5-5-1. While paying particular attention to when it states the intermissions shall take place. Secondly, your example with the FTs occurring at the end of the 4th quarter is not quite accurate because when they should be attempted by rule depends upon what the score is. If the game is tied is the only case in which they are to be attempted as part of the OT period. If the score is not tied, the FTs are either not attempted at all because they won't affect the outcome, or they are attempted immediately and treated as if they are part of the preceeding period, and how many are successful will determine the necessity of OT or not.
So let's assume we have a situation where the game is tied the 4th quarter ends and then a team receives a technical foul BEFORE the timer starts the one minute intermission. If the officials incorrectly administer the FTs before this intermission period takes place, should they be considered part of the 4th quarter or part of the OT? I think that if you took two attorneys and put them in front of a judge to argue what the Rules Book says about this, that the ruling would come down--the officials screwed up and the FTs now have to be considered part of the 4th quarter, so if either one of them is successful the game is over. Bad job officials. That's the theoretical side.
In practice, if I ever found myself in that situation on the court I would purposely go against my belief of what the Rules Book says and continue the game by going to OT. Why? because if I didn't I don't believe that I would ever be allowed on the court again. Not sure what I would do with the arrow. If both free throws were missed, I might very well start the OT with a jump ball because I believe that is correct based upon when the FTs were mistakenly attempted.
As for your last paragraph: yeah, I know how to handle that play, but what does it have to do with our discussion here about officials administering FTs at the improper time?
And saving the best for last:
JR, you have told me numerous times that the 2nd quarter was over (I even agreed that is was over), but you still haven't told me when you think the 3rd quarter started in this game in question. Try looking at it from that view. If you cannot tell me for sure that the FTs were attempted after the 3rd quarter began (not in the twilight zone), then you cannot also give the offended team the possession. I have a hard time believing that we took a ten minute break during the 3rd quarter! That's a laughable situation.
[Edited by Nevadaref on Mar 17th, 2004 at 01:54 AM]