quote:
Originally posted by Mark Padgett on 12-23-1999 11:15 PM
By rule, it can't be. A dribble is started by a player already in player control. That means that before his push to the floor can be considered a dribble, he must have already held the ball (or dribbled previously). If the ball comes to rest in his hand prior to the push, then you have player control and it is the start of a dribble. If the ball never came to rest in his hand, no matter how much he seems to "control" the push, it is not a dribble. The pertinent rules are 4-15-1 which defines a dribble and says it is caused by a player in control, and 4-12-1, which defines player control.
Now I disagree. You are interpreting it to say that you must have player control before beginning a dribble. I argue that the dribble can initiate player control.
Using your definition, if a player bounce passes to another player, and that player does not catch it, but begins to dribble the already bouncing ball, he is not in player control. So he should be able to catch his own dribble (bouncing ball), establish player control, then begin his dribble. WRONG. Anyone here would call the illegal dribble.
4-12-1 (PLAYER CONTROL) - A player is in control of the ball when he/she is holding OR DRIBBLING a live ball in bounds.
4-15-1 (DRIBBLE) - A dribble is ball movement caused by a player in control who bats (intentionally strikes the ball with the hand(s)) or pushes the ball to the floor once or several times.
I stand by the original statement that says if a player bounces the ball to gain control of the ball, that's a dribble. Because the bouncing of the ball initiates the player control. The caveat is that if the ball is still obviously a loose ball (not a controlled bounce), then obviously control has not initiated, and it's not a dribble.
Unfortunately, I can't find a good example of this in the case book, either way...
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Brian Johnson