Quote:
Originally Posted by BillyMac
Alternating possession arrow is pointing toward A’s basket.
A1 is fouled in the act of shooting a successful field goal attempt and is awarded one free throw.
After A1 releases the free throw attempt, knucklehead A2, from a marked lane space, trying to impress his cheerleader girlfriend, grabs the ball while it’s outside the imaginary cylinder and dunks it.
This is not a free throw violation.
As soon as A2 touched the ball, it ended the free throw (by definition) and the ball became dead, thus no point(s) are awarded to A1, nor to A2.
No more offensive goaltending, so no more technical foul for this act during a free throw.
Now what?
When A2 touched the ball the ball became dead with neither team in control, so go the alternating possession arrow, allowing Team A will get the ball for a throwin under their own basket.
Does this seem fair?
Was this the purpose and intent of recent rule change of no more offensive goaltending?
For the past (at least) forty-four years, this (goaltending a free throw) has been technical foul with the harsh penalty of no Team A point for the free throw, two free throws by the best free throw shooter(s) on Team B, and Team B being awarded the ball at the division line for a throwin.
Now, under this circumstance, while there will be no Team A point for the free throw, Team A will benefit by getting the ball for a throwin under their own basket.
Never happen?[/B]
Probably true for the past (at least) forty-four years, but what if Team A was down by three with one second to go the game?
Did the NFHS even consider this situation while considering this recent rule change?
Did something fall through the cracks?
Unintended consequence?
My local IAABO interpreter suggested we consider this an unsporting act and penalize accordingly.
“Not limited to” is subjective and open ended and thus subject to various individual interpretations.
Perhaps the NFHS can get out of this mess with an actual written interpretation in the casebook, or at least as an annual interpretation, of this being an unsporting act.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Raymond
If a teammate of the shooter prevents the ball from hitting the rim why wouldn't it be a violation. Quit trying to make it hard when it's very simple.
By your logic, you would be giving a ball back to the team who just committed the violation in the last second of a game. Just think about that using logical thinking.
Luckily you're not officiating at a level where this could happen. Because all those questions you ask are unnecessary. Teammate touches the ball before it gets to the ring on a free throw, the ball is dead and it's a violation. That's it. Done. You're the only one who wants to make it more complicated than it needs to be.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Raymond
The ball failed to hit the rim on a free throw attempt. Why can't we just call the violation on the shooting team?
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BillyMac
9-1-3-A: After the ball is placed at the disposal of a free thrower: He/she shall throw within 10 seconds to cause the ball to enter the basket or touch the ring before the free throw ends.
4-20-3: The free throw ends when the try is successful, when it is certain the try will not be successful, when the try touches the floor or any player, or when the ball becomes dead.
Raymond is 100% correct.
Careful purposeful reading of the last five words 9-1-3-A make it quite clear, especially when paired with 4-20-3.
The free throw ended when the offensive player, from a marked lane space, touched the ball, and it happened before the ball entered the basket or touched the ring.
Thanks to Raymond for not only his correct interpretation but also for his persistence in getting me back on the straight and narrow.
My local interpreter suggested that this was an unsporting act.
I like Raymond's interpretation better.
It's much simpler, and not based on a subjective interpretation of "unsporting".
My suggested casebook play was never put up "on the ladder", thus no embarrassment to me.
I'm glad that the Official Forum is back online.
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I want to apologize for joining the discussion late, but to be honest the title of the discussion did not resonate with me at first (sorry Billy) until I thought that I had better read it to see what was being discussed and Billy's initial post did resonate with me. It is not my intent to pick on Billy but he raised questions in my mind about that Play we are discussing.
All Rules references are from the
2025-26 NFHS Basketball Rules Book.
1: R9-S1-A3a: After the ball is placed at the disposal of a free thrower: The free thrower shall throw within 10 seconds
to cause the ball to enter the basket or touch the ring before the free throw ends.
2a: Billy, in his first comment said that A1’s FTA ended when A2 touched (“grabbed”) the Ball, and I believe that is an accurate statement per
R4-S20-A3: The free throw ends when the try is successful,
when it is certain the try will not be successful, when the try touches the floor or
any player, or when
the ball becomes dead.
2b: Billy also said: i) no FT Violation had occurred and ii) the Ball became Dead when A2 touched (“grabbed”) the Ball.
3a: Billy, in 2b(i), said that no FT Violation had occurred. My question is: Why? I agree with Billy’s statement in 2a that A1’s FTA ended when A2 touched (“grabbed”) the Ball per
R4-S20-A3 but did A2’s touching (“grabbing”) A1’s FTA cause A1 to violate per
R9-S1-A3?
3b: If A2’s touching (“grabbing”) the Ball indeed cause A1 to commit a FT Violation per
R9-S1-A3 then I agree with Billy saying that the Ball became Dead when A2 touched (“grabbed”) the Ball.
3c: But Billy said that a FT Violation did NOT occur, so I am asking the question: What caused the Ball to become Dead when A2 touched (“grabbed”) the Ball.
4: I definitely agree with Billy’s assessment that this was not Goaltending.
5: In my opinion, A2’s touching (“grabbing”) the Ball is a FT Violation by A1 which causes the Ball to become Dead. Team B is awarded a Designated Spot Throw-in at the nearest Designated Throw-in Spot on the Endline in Team B’s Backcourt.
MTD, Sr.