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Tru_in_Blu Sat Jan 03, 2015 11:18am

2015 ASA Umpire Exam questions
 
I downloaded the exam and started working on it using my 2014 manual and the posted changes on the ASA website.

Following are a few questions I have on the questions.

31. With one out, R1 on 3B, R2 on 1B, B4 singles to right field scoring R1. R2 rounds second, then becomes confused, retouches 2B while moving back toward 1B where they are tagged out. The Umpires rule correctly that R1’s run counts as it was scored before R2 was tagged.
a.) True
b.) False


It seems that this scenario makes more sense if there are 2 outs instead of 1 out. With 1 out, we simply have a runner tagged off a base for the second out and of course R1's run counts.

Tru_in_Blu Sat Jan 03, 2015 11:20am

36. Men’s 40-Over, Men’s Masters 50-Over & Seniors 60-Over) When after completion of 7 innings of play, the score remains tied, starting at the top of the next inning and each half inning thereafter, the offensive team shall begin its turn at bat be placing:
a.) The player who is scheduled to bat last in that half inning on 2B.
b.) The player who made the last out of the previous inning on 2B.
c.) A substitute for the player who is scheduled to be placed on 2B.
d.) Both a. and c.

54. (Women’s and JO Girls Fast Pitch) When after completion of 7 innings of play or 1 hour and 40 minutes in JO pool play and if the score remains tied, starting at the top of the next inning and each half inning thereafter, the offensive team shall begin its turn at bat by placing:
a.) The player who is scheduled to bat last in that half inning on 2B.
b.) The player who made the last out of the previous inning on 2B.
c.) A substitute for the player who is scheduled to be placed on 2B.
d.) Both a. and c.


These questions, virtually identical except for the references to Slow/Fast pitch respectively, are meant to evaluate the tie-breaker rule regarding which member of the batting order should be placed on 2B. I'd prefer answer d.) to be "either" instead of "Both" because clearly we can't have 2 runners place on 2B.

Tru_in_Blu Sat Jan 03, 2015 11:20am

43. In a game played in the Senior Slow Pitch Division, the game is over after four complete innings with the score:
a.) Home 26 - Visitors 10 delta 16
b.) Home 31 - Visitors 9 delta 22
c.) Home 18 - Visitors 3 delta 15
d.) None of the above.


So this is an updated rule as posted:
Rule 5, Section 9A [3]b: Senior Slow Pitch Run Ahead Rule will be – 20 after 4 innings and 15 after 5 innings.
Comment: Removes Run Ahead Rule after 3 innings and defines the new run ahead rule for Senior’s Slow Pitch Classification of Play.

Responses A. & C. clearly don't get to the 20-run differential. I am curious about how in a complete game with the home team winning, how the score got to a differential of 22. Shouldn't the game have been stopped when the differential of 20 was reached? Keep in mind that the scenario indicates that we have completed 4 innings. The only way it makes sense to me is if folks lost track of the score and then tallied after the inning was over.

Tru_in_Blu Sat Jan 03, 2015 11:21am

24. In the third inning, the umpire notices that two bats in Team B’s dugout are leaning against the fence with warming sleeves on them. The umpire should:
a.) Remove those bats for the duration of the game.
b.) Give the manager a warning and remove the warming sleeves.
c.) Eject the manager immediately.
d.) There is no penalty.


I don't have my 2015 manual yet, but couldn't find a specific reference to what an umpire should do. The closest I could find was 3-7-B:
The National Championship UIC, Assistant UIC, or Staff has the right to remove any and all equipment not meeting Rule 3 including bats and helmets, through pregame inspection, bat testing or during a game. Removed equipment will be marked properly with the name of the team and will be returned after the team's final game...
And the last sentence in 3-7-A: Warming devices for bats are not approved.

Unless there is new verbiage that wasn't included in the 2015 Playing Rule Changes and Comments, my guess would be a. but it doesn't go as far as removing the bats for the duration of the tournament, only that particular game. Unless the bats themselves have an issue, it probably doesn't make sense to restrict them beyond the immediate game, but the wording in the manual doesn't seem to support that.

CecilOne Sat Jan 03, 2015 11:30am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tru_in_Blu (Post 948518)
I downloaded the exam and started working on it using my 2014 manual and the posted changes on the ASA website.

Following are a few questions I have on the questions.

31. With one out, R1 on 3B, R2 on 1B, B4 singles to right field scoring R1. R2 rounds second, then becomes confused, retouches 2B while moving back toward 1B where they are tagged out. The Umpires rule correctly that R1’s run counts as it was scored before R2 was tagged.
a.) True
b.) False


It seems that this scenario makes more sense if there are 2 outs instead of 1 out. With 1 out, we simply have a runner tagged off a base for the second out and of course R1's run counts.

Even though R2 is a force out, it is only the second out, not third. :rolleyes:

AtlUmpSteve Sat Jan 03, 2015 11:52am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tru_in_Blu (Post 948520)
43. In a game played in the Senior Slow Pitch Division, the game is over after four complete innings with the score:
a.) Home 26 - Visitors 10 delta 16
b.) Home 31 - Visitors 9 delta 22
c.) Home 18 - Visitors 3 delta 15
d.) None of the above.


So this is an updated rule as posted:
Rule 5, Section 9A [3]b: Senior Slow Pitch Run Ahead Rule will be – 20 after 4 innings and 15 after 5 innings.
Comment: Removes Run Ahead Rule after 3 innings and defines the new run ahead rule for Senior’s Slow Pitch Classification of Play.

Responses A. & C. clearly don't get to the 20-run differential. I am curious about how in a complete game with the home team winning, how the score got to a differential of 22. Shouldn't the game have been stopped when the differential of 20 was reached? Keep in mind that the scenario indicates that we have completed 4 innings. The only way it makes sense to me is if folks lost track of the score and then tallied after the inning was over.

The final batter hit an out-of-the-park homer, and all runners on base (plus the batter) score, even if it exceeds the run-ahead rule.

Tru_in_Blu Sat Jan 03, 2015 12:19pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by AtlUmpSteve (Post 948523)
The final batter hit an out-of-the-park homer, and all runners on base (plus the batter) score, even if it exceeds the run-ahead rule.

Yabbut, that wouldn't be considered a complete inning. I.E. "winning" run scored with 0, 1, or 2 outs.

Tru_in_Blu Sat Jan 03, 2015 12:22pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by CecilOne (Post 948522)
Even though R2 is a force out, it is only the second out, not third. :rolleyes:

Exactly why I questioned why the scenario was written with only 1 out. Curious to see if the answer supports a starting scenario with 1 out or 2 outs. Since the question touches upon the force play being reinstated, and when runs can score, why bother to even mention a possible timing play unless the inning would have be over?

IRISHMAFIA Sat Jan 03, 2015 04:19pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tru_in_Blu (Post 948526)
Exactly why I questioned why the scenario was written with only 1 out. Curious to see if the answer supports a starting scenario with 1 out or 2 outs. Since the question touches upon the force play being reinstated, and when runs can score, why bother to even mention a possible timing play unless the inning would have be over?

So, the answer is true

tcannizzo Sat Jan 03, 2015 04:54pm

31. With one out, R1 on 3B, R2 on 1B, B4 singles to right field scoring R1. R2 rounds second, then becomes confused, retouches 2B while moving back toward 1B where they are tagged out. The Umpires rule correctly that R1’s run counts as it was scored before R2 was tagged.
a.) True
b.) False

My question is who are "they"? Sounds like multiple tag outs, which would not only be R2 but also BR. But then question only mentions that R2 was tagged.
Which still means the run would count, but this may very well be the worst-worded question ever.:(

IRISHMAFIA Sat Jan 03, 2015 09:26pm

Or maybe it was worded perfectly with the intention of catching the umpire looking for something that isn't there. That can be an issue as is demonstrated with this thread :)

Tru_in_Blu Sat Jan 03, 2015 10:56pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA (Post 948571)
Or maybe it was worded perfectly with the intention of catching the umpire looking for something that isn't there. That can be an issue as is demonstrated with this thread :)

That's giving way too much credit to the author of the question.

Wait... did you submit that question for the test? ;)

IRISHMAFIA Sun Jan 04, 2015 08:47am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tru_in_Blu (Post 948582)
That's giving way too much credit to the author of the question.

Wait... did you submit that question for the test? ;)


You need to remember, it was simply a true/false question and no. I could offer the best question in the world and ASA would not use it until they could find a way to make it theirs :)

teebob21 Sun Jan 04, 2015 02:39pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by tcannizzo (Post 948557)
My question is who are "they"? Sounds like multiple tag outs, which would not only be R2 but also BR. But then question only mentions that R2 was tagged.
Which still means the run would count, but this may very well be the worst-worded question ever.:(

My guess is that the writers used the normally-plural pronoun "they" in an effort to be gender neutral. Both sexes play this sport under basically the same baserunning rules: I wish they (the writers) would use he and she more often to reduce confusion.

tcannizzo Sun Jan 04, 2015 04:03pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by teebob21 (Post 948631)
My guess is that the writers used the normally-plural pronoun "they" in an effort to be gender neutral. Both sexes play this sport under basically the same baserunning rules: I wish they (the writers) would use he and she more often to reduce confusion.

My point is that any pronoun, he, she, it, we, they, etc is bad form. Add to it they got singular and plural mixed up...well.

Why not stick with standard rules nomenclature, such as "R2 was tagged" in this case.

Crabby_Bob Wed Jan 07, 2015 12:44pm

53. (Women's and JO Girls Fastpitch) Pushing off and dragging the pivot foot in contact with the ground is not required. a) true b) false


The question exhibits a serious lack of context.

MD Longhorn Wed Jan 07, 2015 02:16pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crabby_Bob (Post 949094)
53. (Women's and JO Girls Fastpitch) Pushing off and dragging the pivot foot in contact with the ground is not required. a) true b) false


The question exhibits a serious lack of context.

It's certainly not required of the center fielder... or the batter... or the scorekeeper.

youngump Wed Jan 07, 2015 02:32pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by MD Longhorn (Post 949116)
It's certainly not required of the center fielder... or the batter... or the scorekeeper.

Hmmm ... but it is required of the pitcher by rule. But would anybody call this? By that I mean a really weak pitcher who just pitches slow pitch style has not pushed off or drug but I'd never thought of calling it illegal.

EsqUmp Thu Jan 15, 2015 06:41pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA (Post 948602)
You need to remember, it was simply a true/false question and no. I could offer the best question in the world and ASA would not use it until they could find a way to make it theirs :)

It's either a "gotcha" question or an improperly worded one, because who the hell else would care? Get real.

IRISHMAFIA Fri Jan 16, 2015 12:06am

Quote:

Originally Posted by EsqUmp (Post 950524)
It's either a "gotcha" question or an improperly worded one, because who the hell else would care? Get real.


I have proctored these tests for a little over a decade and constantly run into umpires who want to parse every 20 word question into a 70 word situation instead of just reading what is there and giving the appropriate answer.

I've never seen a "gotcha" question on an ASA test. In my experience, the ASA test has one purpose: to make the umpire think. From the discussion, it seems that is exactly what it did.

Tru_in_Blu Fri Jan 16, 2015 11:12am

In some cases just reading what is there may not be enough. In some cases a relevant piece of information is missing. So while they may not be intended as "gotcha" questions, there have been several corrections to the test answers over the years.

When I attended a class to become certified as an ASA umpire, the UIC giving the class had us review the previous 5 years umpires' exam. Rule changes notwithstanding, there was often a question or two that he told us to ignore because they were "bad questions".

I think things have improved in the past few years, but from my original post, there are still some nebulous areas on the test. I'm all for "thinking" and some say that I think too much at times. I usually try to envision a test question scenario to something I may have seen at some point. Often times that's easy. Sometimes I have to play it out a bit more and check the book for the answer.

And that's a good thing.

MD Longhorn Fri Jan 16, 2015 11:55am

The thing that is irksome is this: On one question, what seems to the reader to be an error, typo, or oversight turns out to be the test-writer's way of seeing if the reader is paying attention... but on another question, what seems to be an error or oversight is indeed an error or oversight.

So if the test-taker takes the question at it's word, they'll miss 1 of the 2 above ... but if they put away the lawyerese and answer what they think the test-taker meant to be asking, they will also miss 1 of the 2.

IRISHMAFIA Fri Jan 16, 2015 12:52pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by MD Longhorn (Post 950600)
The thing that is irksome is this: On one question, what seems to the reader to be an error, typo, or oversight turns out to be the test-writer's way of seeing if the reader is paying attention... but on another question, what seems to be an error or oversight is indeed an error or oversight.

So if the test-taker takes the question at it's word, they'll miss 1 of the 2 above ... but if they put away the lawyerese and answer what they think the test-taker meant to be asking, they will also miss 1 of the 2.

There is little to no doubt that there can be multiple responses that can or are partially correct lacking certain information, but I have found that was often because the person submitting/writing the question had a preconceived response in mind and did not always venture into other "what if" options.

But my point is, and always has been, just answer what is in front of you. Should you believe there is an answer incorrectly marked wrong, ask for clarification from your UIC.

Tru_in_Blu Fri Jan 16, 2015 01:09pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA (Post 950616)
Should you believe there is an answer incorrectly marked wrong, ask for clarification from your UIC.

I've tried that a few times. When I asked either via e-mail or in a meeting format, the person who corrected my submitted seemed just as confused and simply said that that was the answer on the answer sheet.

Until a clarification comes from the National Office, the lower level UICs, perhaps as high as a state UIC or commissioner don't have the authority to correct such a mistake.

IRISHMAFIA Sat Jan 17, 2015 09:18am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tru_in_Blu (Post 950621)
I've tried that a few times. When I asked either via e-mail or in a meeting format, the person who corrected my submitted seemed just as confused and simply said that that was the answer on the answer sheet.

Until a clarification comes from the National Office, the lower level UICs, perhaps as high as a state UIC or commissioner don't have the authority to correct such a mistake.

Actually, a UIC and/or commissioner can change just about anything they please. :) ASA couldn't care less about the test. And if a state/metro UIC doesn't have the answer to your questions, s/he should have a member of the NUS who they can call for clarification. If s/he will not do that, s/he is not much of a UIC.

CecilOne Mon Jan 19, 2015 06:46pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by MD Longhorn (Post 949116)
It's certainly not required of the center fielder... or the batter... or the scorekeeper.

Do any of them have a "pivot foot"? ;)

youngump Mon Jan 19, 2015 08:47pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by CecilOne (Post 951175)
Do any of them have a "pivot foot"? ;)

They do if they are pivoting. ;)

Tru_in_Blu Mon Jan 19, 2015 09:31pm

Base umpires have a pivot foot.

'Course not many of our local guys use them. :(

Tru_in_Blu Mon Jan 26, 2015 01:07pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tru_in_Blu (Post 948518)
I downloaded the exam and started working on it using my 2014 manual and the posted changes on the ASA website.

Following are a few questions I have on the questions.

31. With one out, R1 on 3B, R2 on 1B, B4 singles to right field scoring R1. R2 rounds second, then becomes confused, retouches 2B while moving back toward 1B where they are tagged out. The Umpires rule correctly that R1’s run counts as it was scored before R2 was tagged.
a.) True
b.) False


It seems that this scenario makes more sense if there are 2 outs instead of 1 out. With 1 out, we simply have a runner tagged off a base for the second out and of course R1's run counts.

As I suspected, this is indeed a bad question.

CecilOne Sun Feb 08, 2015 11:49am

Still catching up from vacation :rolleyes:, posting to keep near top. :)

Insane Blue Sun Feb 08, 2015 04:58pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tru_in_Blu (Post 948518)
I downloaded the exam and started working on it using my 2014 manual and the posted changes on the ASA website.

Following are a few questions I have on the questions.

31. With one out, R1 on 3B, R2 on 1B, B4 singles to right field scoring R1. R2 rounds second, then becomes confused, retouches 2B while moving back toward 1B where they are tagged out. The Umpires rule correctly that R1’s run counts as it was scored before R2 was tagged.
a.) True
b.) False


It seems that this scenario makes more sense if there are 2 outs instead of 1 out. With 1 out, we simply have a runner tagged off a base for the second out and of course R1's run counts.

Locally they fixed it to read 2 outs

Tru_in_Blu Mon Feb 09, 2015 12:51pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Insane Blue (Post 954261)
Locally they fixed it to read 2 outs

Hi, Inshane

Do you guys take the test online?

Here in NH we still do the paper answer sheet and submit it to a local UIC to have it corrected.

Our NFHS test is now online. I like that much better.


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