Being Looked Upon as an OOJ
 

I worked one day of our State ASA tourney this past weekend. Did two plates and two bases of 14U pool and bracket play. For the most part it went okay. But I had one out-of-town team that just made me feel like the proverbial rules nazi.

It started during the equipment check. Not one batting helmet had a chin strap, as required by ASA rules. When my partner and I pointed it out, we of course got the, "Well, the other umpires..." whine. Against our better judgment, we let it go and told them they needed to get chin straps for the next day's play.

A point of emphasis from the tourney staff was to ruthlessly enforce the rule requiring the batter to maintain one foot in the box. I had mentioned that to the coaches at the plate conference. Sure enough, the first batter for this team walked almost halfway up the third base line after a pitch to look for her coach's sign. I asked her to come back and keep a foot in the box. She did it again, and this time I addressed the coach:

Me: "Coach, you need to instruct your batters to keep one foot in the box between pitches."

Coach: "Is that in the rules?"

Me: "Yes, it's a rule penalized with a Strike after a warning."

Coach: "But she has ten seconds, Blue. You're going to rush my batters!"

Groan...

Now the parents start riding me. Each time one of their batters came to the plate, one of them would sarcastically say, "Keep a foot in the batter's box!" And when they would see an opposing team's batter step out of the box, before I even had a chance to say something, they would yell, "HEY BLUE, BE CONSISTENT! CALL A STRIKE!" Mind you, I never ruled a penalty strike on anyone.

Then, this same team had an on-deck batter go to the opposite (first base side) on-deck circle. I held up play and instructed the batter she had to return to the circle next to her dugout. The parents started whining, "But she's left-handed, Blue!" I almost wanted to turn around and tell them, "Who umpires your games anyway?"

I hate it when I become the center of attraction. I don't feel I was being over-officious, especially when the staff emphasizes what they want from us. Why is there always one team that makes things that hard?

O I gnorant T eam J, not O O J

But
"Against our better judgment, we let it go and told them they needed to get chin straps for the next day's play" would be against my better judgment, as well.

Don't you just love when you specifically warn a coach about something and then they want to complain about it later?

Not sure I would have put up with batters being smart mouth about keeping a foot in the box. After a couple I think coach and I would have had a talk about the next one that made a comment would be leaving.

Oh, you think they are listening.

I didn't see anything about smart mouth batters. :confused:

OK. I read it as the batters were the ones making the comment. Rereading it was the parents being mouthy.

I've never made an issue of the one-foot-in-the-box deal as a literal point to be made with players or coaches. I have always considered it (correctly, I think) as a game-management rule to keep things moving.

If a team likes to conduct these little walks halfway to 3rd coaching sessions between pitches, I will start with saying, "Let's go batter." That usually does the trick. After all, I don't really care about where they keep their feet, only that they don't waste time.

If that doesn't do the trick, I will get louder, "LET"S GO, BATTER"!

Rarely have I had to resort to anything more punitive, but the next step would be asking the coach if he wants TIME for a conference.

Frankly, I find the arm band multi-color signal encyclopedias everyone seems to be using these days to be much more of a time waster. I had a team yesterday that had a multiple page arm band, where the players would have to open the thing up to find the signal.

Had another team a week ago where the coach would relay the pitch signal to the catcher, the catcher would signal the pitcher, the pitcher would stare at her arm band for a few seconds, and then finally prepare to pitch. On the bright side, there were no quick pitches! :D

And, both of these were 16 or 18 year olds!

But, jeez... how may nuances does a team need for softball signals?

While I agree and really dont care if the batter has a foot in the box or 2' outside of it, as long as they arent delaying the game what difference does it make? But, go to nationals and the UIC tells you the batter WILL keep a foot in the box you best make sure they do or your tournament grade will show the result.

I typically don't either. But again, it was a point of emphasis in the tournament which I felt compelled to mention during the plate conference.

If the girls stepped one or two steps out of the box, I wouldn't have said anything. But this team went a little above and beyond, and I reminded the coach. If he would have responded with, "No worries, Blue; I'll take care of it," no problem. But instead, he had to ask me if it was in the rules, and then told me his batters have ten seconds. Why do they have to be that way? :(

I'm glad it's not just me.

Rita

Are you sure?? All of the above is fiction! ;) :p :D :D :D

That is not your call. The is up to the TD, not the umpire

That's were you start calling strikes for the rest of the game.


Because they don't really know how to play the game and they think they can get away with being asses away from home.

Once had a HS team and their parents that behaved so poorly on and off the field AT DISNEY they were asked to leave and never come back. Turns out the umpire was a friend of mine and gave me a heads up. I held a pre-game with the crew that had their first game back home. The PU warned them there will be no tolerance of........there was a list of about 6 things my friend noted and he covered them all. The coaches and captains stood there with their jaws dropped with a "how the **** did they know about that look" on their face. It was great!

Had the same thing at an Eastern National a few years back with a team from OH. TD couldn't wait to get rid of them.

This past weekend I had to enforce, over and over, batters leaving the box, on-deck batters using the wrong circle, multiple on-deck batters being out of the dugout swinging bats all at once and pitchers stepping onto the plate with their hands already joined.

Every time, it was like no one had ever heard of that before... :confused:

"As the head coach, it is your responsibility to ensure that your players play by the rules, right coach?"

Dump the onus back on the coaches. Get them to work with you, rather than against you if possible.

Even when it is a book rule ?? :confused:

I think Irish's point is that it wasn't our call to tell the coach to go out and find chin straps for the next day.

But I believe it is our call to decide whether or not the current game gets played. We had eight or so batting helmets that were not in compliance with the rules. IMHO, we did have the authority to not play the game until the coach made those helmets compliant.

Now, if the TD got involved and said, "Play the game anyway," I guess that's within his/her purview. I'm curious if a TD would make that decision.

Not any I've come across.

How many helmets did you have in compliance?

Not a one. All of their helmets were missing straps.

This all stems from LRAMBF. They play all season under absurd rules and then are suddenly taken aback when asked to play real softball.

I think Irish was saying it's the TD's call to allow the team to play if they weren't in compliance. Not the umpires. "Sir, I cannot let your batters bat without chinstraps unless the TD tells me to waive that rule for you." And only one TD I know around here would have let them play (that one ... anything for a buck, ALWAYS sides with teams, came onto my field once and wouldn't leave and I was the one that got in trouble... I don't work there anymore.

Or is it lack of enforcement by the "regular season" umps. :rolleyes:

Could be.

However, when I see some team trying to put their ODB's in the wrong circle, I know that team is coming from some place that has made up rules, and I'm anticipating something idiotic from that coach (or parents or both) at some point.

I've umpired in leagues, baseball mostly (can't recall ever seeing it in softball) where they have a local safety rule to keep the ODB behind the batter up to bat because there is very little room in foul territory. I don't have a problem with that.

But in this case, the ODB went to the wrong circle because she was a lefty. That obviously has nothing to do with safety.

You never know what people think is "safety" related. :)

I have no problem with the on-deck batter being behind the hitter in youth sports. It's amazing, though, that this is a question I have to ask just about every game I'm coaching this year, though.

ON-DECK CIRCLE: The area nearest the offensive team’s dugout in which the next batter is restricted to before the release of the pitch.

ODB is on her side of the field, regardless of handedness of the batter.
If the facilities don't allow for safe enough distance, they stay behind the fence.

Between innings, I'm positioned on the defense side of the plate & first batter warms up on her side.

Coach complaining: parents being sarcastic? Was the team from NY or NJ? :)

Are chin straps required to be on the helmets at the pre game inspection?

If they are not there, I ususally ask the coach...."you have chin straps for the helmets, right?"

If a batter comes to the plate without a chin strap, I will stop play and not let her bat until there is a chin strap in place.

My experience is that a team will have a number of chin straps that they switch between helmets.

Local rules and all that. I ask because it's been 80% behind the batter for us this season. Only 2 umpires have mentioned proper ASA rules. I do whatever they ask in this regard...I pick my battles.

If the purpose of the inspection of "hats and bats" is to ensure compliance with the rules, absolutely, IMHO. Otherwise, why bother having the inspection at pre-game? We could just do a cursory exam as each batter comes to the plate.

That's always been my experience as well, until this particular team showed up.

I don't know if expecting something idiotic necessarily follows.

The "ODB uses the circle behind the batter" is almost 100% universal in MN for girls fastpitch.

The MSHSL (high schools) adopted this as an experiment with permission from the NFHS several years ago, and has retained it. At least a couple of years before that, the predominant girls fastpitch association in MN wrote it into their rule book, and it has since been adopted as a local rule by most fastpitch leagues.

It is viewed as a safety rule.

It is silly and unnecessary, of course. Besides the fact that being behind the batter is not actually safe, if the field really is too small to accommodate a proper distance from the ODC and the plate, just keep the ODB in the dugout!

Nonetheless, I wouldn't expect that all MN teams' coaches would be idiotic just because of this! ;)

Well in your case that makes sense. It's not out of the ordinary there.

The reason I expect something nonsensical from a coach who does that here is that it's NOT normal here. It means they come from some area that felt compelled to add that to their rules AND the coach is not even aware that it's abnormal. (One would think that once tourney season starts, they would have had the opportunity to have the odd-rules-stuff knocked off of them after just one weekend).

IOW - if they are doing this abnormal thing in the summer, then I can usually expect them to do something or say something equally abnormal.

No need for the crew to struggle with the decision to 'go with' or "against [its] better judgement."
It was....."our State ASA tourney...." as such, it was Championship play. As a crew, why would you choose to set aside 3.5-E without consultation (either on-site or by phone) with the TD or the UIC assigned to the site?

Where in the rule book does it allow the umpire crew to waive the required equipment?

AFA the ODC is concerned, if the field is that small that room is limited, the ODC should be outside the fence with a team area designation.

And, of course, no one has a problem with alleged "safety" rules, right up until the whining starts because this player said this or called her that or is accused of trying to steal signs or blocking the coach giving signs, yada, yada, yada.....and yes, it DOES happen and I pity the umpire who thinks that once a comment to that effect is made, it will stop with a warning.

Agreed.

Maybe it's the mythical "Minnesota Nice", but we've been using this in girls fastpitch for a number of years in both high school and travel ball from 10U through 18U, and speaking personally, I've had no problems at all in any of the games I've umpired. I still don't like the rule (I think it is pointless and silly), but it has created no problems in my games.

It doesn't matter to me. Just tell me what you want so I can tell my girls which side they have to go to.

BTW, I am enjoying sitting on a bucket outside the dugout, though, knowing I would never allow such a thing when I'm umpiring. I always wait till the other coach does it first. :D

This made me laugh as I remembered an incident from earlier this summer. I'm coaching 1st base in my daughter's 8U coach-pitch game. The opposing team coach is sitting on a bucket outside of the dugout when one of our players comes to bat without proper equipment. He immediately starts complaining to the PU to make the girl get a new helmet. He looks at me and says, "I'm sorry, but rules are rules." I just smiled and nodded and waited as our batter swapped helmets with a friend. Ahhh, the irony.

I am going to disagree with those of you who think the ODB being in the ODC behind the batter isn't safer.

I have seen ODB's in safe ODC's get hit by foul balls. One instance was at a University of Michigan game. The batter was late on her swing and hit a screaming line drive into the ODC where her team mate was standing. Thankful it did not her square and only glanced off her arm. Still it hurt her enough that the trainer had to take a look at her.

I'm sure the ODC at Michigan meets all of the distance requirements for being away from the plate.

What I have yet to see is a batter in the ODC behind the batter get hit by anything hit remotely hard towards her.

The league I work rec ball in has the requirement that the ODB be in the ODC behind the batter. The reason? A few years ago we had a girl seriously injured taking a foul ball off the side of the neck while standing in the ODC in front of the batter. Was she paying attention to what was going on? From what I heard no, but we needed to be prepared for worst case situations and the worst case situation is a line drive hit into the ODC while the ODB isn't paying attention.

Now as for the stealing signs or talking trash issue. Our rule is simple. If there is anything witnessed by the umpire (s) the team loses the ODC for the remainder of the game. We have yet to enforce this since I've been working that league.

So in the ball you work, every batter swings late? The ODB is only unsafe if on the opposite side?

Start calling higher level ball where the dead pull hitters jerk everything foul behind them, and with much greater force than hitting opposite. Your U of Michigan Sierra Lawrence could take the head off the on deck batter; she grew up in my area.

Just because you haven't seen it in your JV schedule doesn't make it remotely appropriate for higher level play. No major organization, NCAA, ISF, ASA, NFHS allow on deck batters anywhere but THEIR side; for good reasons.

Nowhere, I was questioning your comment that the TD could overrule a book rule.

"That is not your call. The is up to the TD, not the umpire"

except for ASA Men's FP, because they whined about it.

I never claimed that behind the batter wasn't safer; I said it was "not actually safe". As I said, I have a number of years experience with this rule, up through 18U and varsity high school, and I have seen a number of screaming foul balls hit toward the ODB behind the batter, and a few make contact. It could be argued that being behind the batter gives the ODB a false sense of safety and could lead to even more inattention.

Nonetheless, in your example, if they wanted to actually put the ODC in a safe location, they'd put it outside the fence. Any location within the playing field is still subject to being hit by a batted ball:
Minor League Coach Killed By Line Drive

There is a HS coach near here who insists on having ithe ODB about 15 feet from the batter instead of 30 feet, when behind the batter.
He kind of proved geometrically that the angle to the closer position is even less likely for the batter to hit the ODB.
This is 3rd base dugout with RH batters.

The TD has the authority to do whatever necessary to complete the tournament. I think it is ridiculous that they can, but my point actually was the umpire CANNOT.

BTW, this is routine in your area when it came to state tournaments whether it was a uniform or ball or double-base or chin straps or whatever.

Because I know the TD personally, and she would have said the same thing. I wasn't going to waste the time trying to get a hold of her to get an answer that I know quite well what it would be.

Except that if someone got hurt, you would have been duly authorized to make the exception instead of hanging out there on your own.

OK....but that decision on your part contributed to the game getting of to a 'bumpy' start, and as indicated in your OP, got bumpier from a game management standpoint.

And what do you suggest I should have done differently to prevent the 'bumpy' start? Ignore the missing chin straps and not say anything? Gotten the TD involved?

I thought what my partner and I did was rather reasonable under the circumstances. Neither of us came across as jerks. We asked the question, they told us they didn't have any and that previous umpires didn't say anything, and we decided to play the game without them. We made no rude comments like, "Well, your previous umpires were wrong," or, "Don't you guys know the rules?" We simply told them they needed to get some for the next day, and we went on with our checks.

I think we're pretty unanimous on "gotten the TD involved". Waiving that requirement is NOT your call, even if you knew what the call would be. (PS - exactly one TD I work with would have waived this requirement --- too much liability).

Agreed. Even though the chances of a player getting injured due to not having a chin strap is small, and even though many of them wear them so loose they provide no practical safety benefit, our society is so litigious it is just not worth it.

Besides, this is NOT a new rule. ASA has required chin straps for maybe 10 years. This is all on the team for being woefully ignorant and unprepared.

And might actually add risk.

Any chance wearing them snugly comes under wearing equipment properly or dangerous ITUJ?

So noted. But I still don't see how that would have eliminated the 'bumpy' start that we experienced, to address KJUmp's point. In fact, it would have made things more 'bumpy'.

I suppose that's possible. It might depend on how you went about it. "Coach, I don't have the authority to ignore that rule, we'd need Tony do decide on that... let's have someone get Tony over here."

Then again --- he could still be a jerk to you after that. He is, after all, rat enough to not know they have to have chin-straps. It's not like that's new.