Thanks, Mike.. I hate this notebook I have. I have written 4-6 responses to posts and I touch something on the notebook and boom, the writing is gone.

Ron

So what is the call when they do call a tie?

The runner will either be safe or out, so there is no tie.

I think Irish's point is this. Rule says defense must put the runner out prior to reaching the base. If you tie (happened at the same time) then the ball wasn't there before the runner so the defense did not put the runner out prior to them reaching the base, thus the safe call.

Now in the real world we all know there are no ties.....we get paid the $1,000 a game to determine which came first, safe or out!! After that we start in on the chicken and egg issue.:D

Exactly. Just because the book doesn't acknowledge "Tie" as a valid ruling does not mean they do not exists in the real world. Yet the rule book may recognize such an event by clearly placing the onus on the defense to succeed in retiring the runner prior to reaching the base. Ergo, the defense's failure to do so defaults in a ruling of "safe".

Was that sarcasm? :rolleyes: Bazinga! ;)

Understood (and agree) but my point is if there were "ties" would would then be forced to also have "do-overs!"

And you are being underpaid at that rate!:)

Do you not......oh, never mind!

'I don't understand - why can not the action be perceived as simultaneous? I understand in actuality, it is extremely unlikely that you have a "tie", but .......

So? This is a softball board, isn't it?

No, you don't understand... If there was a "tie", buy rule you do not have an out.

I understand perfectly as I said four posts above!

I also understand there can be no tie called. Why look for tie's? Why worry about them?

By rule "It is the defense's responsibility to put the runner out, not for the runner to be the defense. Rules require the defense to put out the runner before they reach 1B" as in post #7

Rule mentions no tie, there is no need for a mention so why bother trying to see a tie!

The defense makes the out, or they don't.

If you perceivea tie, your perception will be wrong. The ball or the runner got there first by at least a millionth (or billionth, or trillionth, etc.) of a second.

Yes, this is a softball board. Just making an observation. Not only are they games played two different ways, they are also officiated two different ways.

If I happen to perceive a tie, then I'm going have to judge it a tie. How do you expect to rule on something that is beyond the abilities of human perception? If you perceive a tie, but still rule that one event or the other happened first, then you are just guessing at the outcome.

Yet, MLB has the same rule, the runner or base must be touched BEFORE the runner reaches the base.

Rule 7.08

(e) He or the next base is tagged before he touches the next base, after he has been

forced to advance by reason of the batter becoming a runner.

And to continue this idiotic discussion......

All we can rule on is what we perceive

1a : to attain awareness or understanding of
b : to regard as being such <perceived threats> <was perceived as a loser>

2: to become aware of through the senses; especially : see, observe


if you perceive the ball hit the outside corner, it hit the outside corner..

(I will try to leave this my last comment on the subject)

What's the mechanic for that? :D

shrug your shoulders and say tie goes to the rnner. everyone will agree.:D