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Old Wed Mar 28, 2012, 10:37pm
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Dirt and the ball

Pitcher takes ball and rubs the ball on the dirt. What do you do, if anything?

High school rules. Please use rule.

Thank you.

Rita
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Old Thu Mar 29, 2012, 12:07am
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Do you 'do anything' any other time the ball rubs on the dirt?
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Old Thu Mar 29, 2012, 12:13am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by okla21fan View Post
Do you 'do anything' any other time the ball rubs on the dirt?
That's not helpful.
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Old Thu Mar 29, 2012, 12:20am
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Call time. Walk out to the pitcher and tell her not to do that again and give her a different ball. Tell her coach. Return the ball to the home coach if you judge it has been defaced and get a replacement. If she repeats doing it again eject.

ART. 6 . . . Any defacing, treatment or device that would change the ball spec-
ifications listed in 1-3-3 are prohibited and render the ball illegal.

Paul
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Old Thu Mar 29, 2012, 06:15am
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Originally Posted by Az.Ump View Post
Call time. Walk out to the pitcher and tell her not to do that again and give her a different ball. Tell her coach. Return the ball to the home coach if you judge it has been defaced and get a replacement. If she repeats doing it again eject.

ART. 6 . . . Any defacing, treatment or device that would change the ball spec-
ifications listed in 1-3-3 are prohibited and render the ball illegal.

Paul
Have you ever seen a ball DEFACED by dirt? Which "specification" was changed?
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Old Thu Mar 29, 2012, 07:11am
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Normal wear and tear of the ball is one thing, purposely grinding the ball into the ground is defacing the ball.
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Old Thu Mar 29, 2012, 07:49am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EsqUmp View Post
Have you ever seen a ball DEFACED by dirt? Which "specification" was changed?
Then why does MLB change change them out once they are fouled into the dirt?

Must just be a "clone" thing huh?
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Old Thu Mar 29, 2012, 08:45am
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Originally Posted by Rita C View Post
That's not helpful.
I thought it was.
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Old Thu Mar 29, 2012, 08:46am
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Originally Posted by RKBUmp View Post
Normal wear and tear of the ball is one thing, purposely grinding the ball into the ground is defacing the ball.
I agree, but she said rub - and I take her at her word. Grinding or something prolonged that I think may damage the ball, I would address as above.

Just rubbing it? That's nothing.
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Old Thu Mar 29, 2012, 09:11am
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Originally Posted by umpire12 View Post
they change them because the mark on the ball makes it easier for the batter to pick up the rotation of the ball not because they believe the ball has been defaced.occasionally after an infield hit, the pitcher will request a new ball because of a dirt mark on the ball but most of the time, after a pitch in the dirt, its the catcher who requests an inspection from the umpire not the batter. if the catcher thought he could give his pitcher an advantage by through a defaced ball , dont you think he would just return the marked ball to the pitcher?
Nice try.
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Old Thu Mar 29, 2012, 11:32am
JEL JEL is offline
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Originally Posted by umpire12 View Post
they change them because the mark on the ball makes it easier for the batter to pick up the rotation of the ball not because they believe the ball has been defaced.occasionally after an infield hit, the pitcher will request a new ball because of a dirt mark on the ball but most of the time, after a pitch in the dirt, its the catcher who requests an inspection from the umpire not the batter. if the catcher thought he could give his pitcher an advantage by through a defaced ball , dont you think he would just return the marked ball to the pitcher?
So a "dirty ball" is not defaced?
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Old Thu Mar 29, 2012, 12:16pm
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I fail to see how rubbing a little dirt on a ball is going to change the size, COR, compression, or the weight & circumference of the ball.
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Old Thu Mar 29, 2012, 12:38pm
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Originally Posted by umpirebob71 View Post
I fail to see how rubbing a little dirt on a ball is going to change the size, COR, compression, or the weight & circumference of the ball.
Placing rock resin doesn't change any of those either (at least not making it outside acceptable tolerances) but it still changes the ball, makes it easier to grab so it's illegal. Same concept here scuffing it a precise manner that allows the pitcher to get a better grip to throw a more wicked (choose pitch) is an advantage and illegal by rule.
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Old Thu Mar 29, 2012, 12:57pm
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I agree, Dave. The point I was was trying to make was that applying 1-3-6 is, I think, incorrect. I feel that 6-2-2 is a little more accurate. Just my humble opinion.
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Old Thu Mar 29, 2012, 01:11pm
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I actually address this with HS coaches when I see it during their scrimmages/play days.

The OP clearly indicates the ball being rubbed in the dirt. I've even seen pitchers drop the ball and stand on the ball and move their feet to grind the ball into the ground.

As the umpire in a game I would stop them immediately and instruct them to not do it again.

I will inspect the ball and either keep it or replace it. I will then instruct the coach that if their player believe the ball to be too slippery, I will be more than happy to rub it down, or maybe have them rub it down in their hands. If they want to use dirt, I don't have a problem with that as long as all they are doing is rubbing it down, not marking or scraping it.

I make it clear to the coaches that any player found to be doing so after our little talk will need to find a seat on the bench.

I think the issue in the OP isn't so much the dirt, but how the pitcher was attempting to scuff up the ball.
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