quick Q regarding R1 passing R2
 

too lazy to look it up to verify

not that it matters but SP game, 2 outs, 1st and 2nd, deep fly ball hit, R1 moves about 1' off the base, R2 is running full speed and passed R1 before the ball is caught.

R2 is out and the batter who hit the fly ball leads off the next inning correct?

No. The BR put the ball into play which completes that player's turn at bat.

Nope
 

The runner that does the passing is the runner called out. The ball remains live. The batter has completed his/her turn at bat.

No. You basically have 4 outs here. Batters PA was over.

And, I'm too lazy to answer. Nevermind that my wiseass answer takes just as much effort as a real answer, I like my wiseass answer better. Don't you? :D

thanks everyone, dakota wins the award for best answer, i knew there be at least one.

follow up questions,

rule 8-1-a says the batter becomes a BR as soon as the batter legally hits a fair ball.

the relevant definition of a fair ball is subsection C) while on or over fair territory, touches the person, attached equiptment or clothing of a player or umpire.

rule 7-2-C says the first batter in each inning is the batter who follows the last player who completed their at bat in the previous inning.

is rule 8-1-a the relevant rule to invoke to determine which batter completed their turn at bat thus determines who leads off the following inning?

what if the batter hit a long foul ball and R1 is passed by R2 before the ball is caught?

what if the batter hit a long obviously out of play ball, R1 never moves, and R2 runs full speed on contact and passes R1 before the ball is out of play?

what if the batter hits a dribbler down the line, R2 passes R1 before the ball is touched or settles and the ball eventually becomes foul?

No. 8-1 is only half of the ways a batter ends their PA. Read 8-2 as well (this includes the caught fly ball (fair/foul not relevant on a caught fly ball).

On your obviously out of play ball (assuming you don't mean a home run), I think you'd best "decide" that the ball was out of play before the runner was passed. I think you could wiggle your way out of a protest if you ruled the other way, and be technically correct ... but I think we both know that is not the INTENT of that rule.

""decide" that the ball was out of play "
Predictive umpiring, is that the same as preventive umpiring?

Also, the bolded part is ambiguous to me.

If the batter did not become a batter-runner by putting the ball into play, how do you account for calling a runner out for passing another? It is not possible.

OK. Don't all your questions have the same answer?? Or were they all rhetorical?

Without a fair batted ball, there are no running violations absent interference. No one has an obligation to run bases correctly when there is no obligation to run bases.

True.

The only one he posted that was vaguely interesting was this:
what if the batter hits a dribbler down the line, R2 passes R1 before the ball is touched or settles and the ball eventually becomes foul?

Generally, with the ball in play and rolling on the ground, BU is watching the runners and is going to call an out the moment the passing occurs... but then when the ball rolls foul.... :eek:

How about slow pitch with stealing...and a really, really dumb trailing runner. :rolleyes:

Not sure what I'm missing here or what you really meant. Batter becoming a batter-runner has absolutely nothing to do with whether runners can run or not. Runners can move without the batter becoming BR unless you're in a non-stealing division.

How?
 

When the batter/runner passed the runner at 1st base he was out. That's the third out. How did you get a fourth out? The caught fly ball no longer matters as you already have the third out.

Just to add some fun.
 

What if bases are loaded and the runner from 3rd scores prior to the batter/runner passing the other runner at 1st base?

Untrue on so many levels. Are you really saying that the BR is NOT out in this situation?

This is only "fun" if you screw it up and don't call the Batter out on the fly ball ... like you implied. You've actually illustrated a perfect example of why what you posted is incorrect.

in my scenarios, the BR doesnt pass anyone, the runner who was on 1st passes the runner who was on 2nd.

i honestly dont know

to be clear, rule 8-7-D, when a runner passes a preceding runner...... makes no mention of being a fair batter ball only.

and there is a period of time, however small, when its unknown if the ball if fair or foul.

is there something else ive overlooked?

Yeah, maybe I twisted this too far. The point is, TWP aside, that the violation doesn't occur without the batter becoming a BR and you have to account for that action. I really don't care what the scorekeepers do with it, but unless this is the case of a play with an illegal glove or by an unreported substitute, that batter complete the AB. There isn't anything else in the book of which I am aware which allows that batter to hit again until the next time that slot comes around.

whats twp?

and what happens if the batter hits a long fly foul uncaught ball and R2 passes R1 before it becomes a foul ball? or if the batter hits a dribble down the line, R2 passes R1 while the ball is in fair territory, but the ball eventually settles foul?

TWP= Third World Play (A play that is remotely possible, but not very likely to happen).

If the batted ball becomes foul, runners are not entitled to advance. If they weren't entitled to advance, there can't be a violation involving advancing runners.

Or go back to post #11 which effectively says the same thing ......

Foul balls are dead balls. There are no running requirements for foul balls other than not interfering, so there are no (other) running violations.

+1

On the dribbler down the line, or the long fly that ends up foul or out of play - in both cases you COULD have BU ruling the runner out before the status of the ball is determined. Yes, it would look ugly, but once the ball's status ends up being foul, you have to jump in your time machine and un-ring that OUT bell. As Steve said, there are NO running requirements for foul balls (other than INT)... consider a similar situation - runner off on the pitch, misses 2nd while rounding third - ball goes foul or out of play, and runner again misses 2nd on the way back. You're not going to rule that runner out on appeal, are you? Of course not. Similar logic here - the runners are not out for something they do during what turns out to be a foul ball (other than INT)

thanks for the help. i wasnt sure on the long fly ball/dribble down the line scenarios since it doesnt expliclity say it has to be a fair ball in the 'runner is out' section.