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Zepp Mon Aug 16, 2010 09:55am

Interference in ASA? (Padres vs Giants video)
 
Saw this play on Sportscenter (Padres vs Giants game on 8/13/10) the other day and it got me thinking about if this same play were in an ASA softball game and what the appropriate call would be.

Umps sure call on moot protest was right | MLB.com: News

Towards the end of the video are some better angles on the play and also their first mention of a "deflected ball."

The MLB rule states nothing about a deflected ball scenario unlike ASA were the interference has to be intentional by the runner after a deflected batted ball. (ASA Rule 8-7-J-4)

Just looking for some opinions (ASA ruleset) on whether it's a
1) no call (play on)
2) obstruction (delayed dead ball signal given, protect runner to 2nd base)
3) interference (dead ball - runner is out)

KJUmp Mon Aug 16, 2010 11:20am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zepp (Post 688841)
Saw this play on Sportscenter (Padres vs Giants game on 8/13/10) the other day and it got me thinking about if this same play were in an ASA softball game and what the appropriate call would be.

Umps sure call on moot protest was right | MLB.com: News

Towards the end of the video are some better angles on the play and also their first mention of a "deflected ball."

The MLB rule states nothing about a deflected ball scenario unlike ASA were the interference has to be intentional by the runner after a deflected batted ball. (ASA Rule 8-7-J-4)

Just looking for some opinions (ASA ruleset) on whether it's a
1) no call (play on)
2) obstruction (delayed dead ball signal given until runner reaches 2nd)
3) interference (dead ball - runner is out)

How could there possibly have been obstruction on that play?

MD Longhorn Mon Aug 16, 2010 01:15pm

And please don't hold your arm out until they reach second. Mechanically wrong and you look silly.

Zepp Mon Aug 16, 2010 01:16pm

Is a deflected batted ball treated the same as a batted ball?
I would have to say no.

If they were the same then why have it as a separate rule under the interference section (rule 8-7-J)
and not include it with a batted ball in the obstruction rule (8-5-B-4)

Rule 8-5-B-4 - When a runner, while advancing or returning to a base
a) is obstructed by a fielder who neither has the ball or
b) is attempting to field a batted or thrown bal
l or
c) when a fielder fakes a tag w/o the ball

Therefore, the fielder does not have possession of the ball, is not fielding a batted ball (deflected - yes, batted - no) and is hindering the progress of the runner. Obstruction?

MD Longhorn Mon Aug 16, 2010 01:18pm

I can't run the video ... who did it deflect off of?

Zepp Mon Aug 16, 2010 01:19pm

Pitcher

MD Longhorn Mon Aug 16, 2010 01:33pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zepp (Post 688853)
Pitcher

Kind of changes everything, doesn't it?

Interference.

Zepp Mon Aug 16, 2010 01:40pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by mbcrowder (Post 688861)
Kind of changes everything, doesn't it?

Interference.

ASA Rule citation to back that up?

MD Longhorn Mon Aug 16, 2010 02:12pm

Sorry - got my alphabet soups mixed up there. Not enough coffee yet today. ASA, the contact must be intentional on a deflected ball. NFHS, the pitcher is excluded from that. My bad - yes, this is not interference.

As to obstruction, again, I can't see the video. If the fielder cause the runner to alter their path without possession of the ball, you would have obstruction. HTBT, so not seeing the video until I get home, I plead the 5th.

Just don't hold that arm up until they reach 2nd!!! :)

KJUmp Mon Aug 16, 2010 02:47pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zepp (Post 688851)
Is a deflected batted ball treated the same as a batted ball?
I would have to say no.

If they were the same then why have it as a separate rule under the interference section (rule 8-7-J)
and not include it with a batted ball in the obstruction rule (8-5-B-4)

Rule 8-5-B-4 - When a runner, while advancing or returning to a base
a) is obstructed by a fielder who neither has the ball or
b) is attempting to field a batted or thrown bal
l or
c) when a fielder fakes a tag w/o the ball

Therefore, the fielder does not have possession of the ball, is not fielding a batted ball (deflected - yes, batted - no) and is hindering the progress of the runner. Obstruction?

So as the umpire you're going to make an obstruction call on that play, based on a strict literal interpretation of the rule, and with no regard for what you saw take place on the video of the play?

MD Longhorn Mon Aug 16, 2010 02:53pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by KJUmp (Post 688870)
So as the umpire you're going to make an obstruction call on that play, based on a strict literal interpretation of the rule, and with no regard for what you saw take place on the video of the play?

KJ, I can't see it - what happened in the video, and what makes you say it's not OBS?

Andy Mon Aug 16, 2010 02:53pm

The ball was deflected by the pitcher, so any interference has to be intentional. i did not see anything intentional on the part of the runner.

Under ASA rules, I have obstruction on the second baseman (and I am putting my arm out immediately).

Under NFHS rules, I do have an interference call as F4 is in the process of making the "initial play". The deflection of the ball by the pitcher is a moot point for this ruleset.

CecilOne Mon Aug 16, 2010 03:43pm

The video looks like definite hindrance, by whom is just a question of which rule as Andy and others said. If deflection off the pitcher overides "fielding a batted ball", then it looks like OBS. If not, it looks like INT. Then, whether intent matters in one rule set or the other affects the call and of course whether the umpire judges it intentional.

KJUmp Mon Aug 16, 2010 04:10pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by mbcrowder (Post 688872)
KJ, I can't see it - what happened in the video, and what makes you say it's not OBS?

mb...
Anyway you can run it by going directly to the Padres team site thru the MLB website? It's there, click on "More News" on the Padre site and you'll see the headline.
KJ

MD Longhorn Mon Aug 16, 2010 04:27pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by KJUmp (Post 688886)
mb...
Anyway you can run it by going directly to the Padres team site thru the MLB website? It's there, click on "More News" on the Padre site and you'll see the headline.
KJ

Those are all simply blocked here at work. I have to wait until I get home.


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