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IRISHMAFIA Thu May 28, 2009 07:15pm

NCAA Championship
 
MI-AL

R1(1B), one out, check-swing dribbler.

First base umpire, after a ball thrown past F4 covering 1B and BR advances to 2B steps into foul territory and damn near steps in front of the defender with the ball checking R1 at 3B.

What the hell is she doing there? This may be where the "rim" mentality places the umpire in the LAST place she should be.

3SPORT Thu May 28, 2009 09:26pm

I have it dvr'd and I have not seen the play. Without seeing the play but possibly the BU was heading home as they were rotated and got caught in a bad place?

IRISHMAFIA Thu May 28, 2009 09:50pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by 3SPORT (Post 605326)
I have it dvr'd and I have not seen the play. Without seeing the play but possibly the BU was heading home as they were rotated and got caught in a bad place?

I understand where she was going, but once you are stuck, you stay still, not run into the play.

ronald Thu May 28, 2009 10:21pm

how did 1st base umpire get to third base. confused:eek:

IRISHMAFIA Thu May 28, 2009 10:48pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by ronald (Post 605332)
how did 1st base umpire get to third base. confused:eek:

front of the defender with the ball checking R1 at 3B.

Big Slick Fri May 29, 2009 08:09am

Quote:

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA (Post 605293)
MI-AL

R1(1B), one out, check-swing dribbler.

First base umpire, after a ball thrown past F4 covering 1B and BR advances to 2B steps into foul territory and damn near steps in front of the defender with the ball checking R1 at 3B.

What the hell is she doing there? This may be where the "rim" mentality places the umpire in the LAST place she should be.

Mike, "rim" mentality had nothing to do with this play, ball was still in the infield. Her mistake was not reacting to the overthrow properly. The play started with a runner on first, and that play specifically is difficult to rotate out of. I know as U1 in this situation, my attention has been on the BR, not going home. It seemed to me (with that 1400 mile through the TV psychic ability that I have) that the "I need to be home" light came on. Ergo, let's chalk this up to bad mechanic rather than blaming the "rim."

kcg NC2Ablu Fri May 29, 2009 08:42am

I agree she moved out of refelx rather than thought

Skahtboi Fri May 29, 2009 08:45am

Quote:

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA (Post 605293)
MI-AL

R1(1B), one out, check-swing dribbler.

First base umpire, after a ball thrown past F4 covering 1B and BR advances to 2B steps into foul territory and damn near steps in front of the defender with the ball checking R1 at 3B.

What the hell is she doing there? This may be where the "rim" mentality places the umpire in the LAST place she should be.

I think she was a)nervous, or b)just didn't belong at that level, or c)both. I noticed on several force plays she was about 6 ft from the play. A little close to be taking in all of the elements.

IRISHMAFIA Fri May 29, 2009 09:10am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skahtboi (Post 605406)
I think she was a)nervous, or b)just didn't belong at that level, or c)both. I noticed on several force plays she was about 6 ft from the play. A little close to be taking in all of the elements.

Trust me, Traci is qualified to be there.

Skahtboi Fri May 29, 2009 09:10am

Quote:

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA (Post 605412)
Trust me, Traci is qualified to be there.

Then maybe a)????? :D

IRISHMAFIA Fri May 29, 2009 09:19am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Big Slick (Post 605395)
Mike, "rim" mentality had nothing to do with this play, ball was still in the infield. Her mistake was not reacting to the overthrow properly. The play started with a runner on first, and that play specifically is difficult to rotate out of. I know as U1 in this situation, my attention has been on the BR, not going home. It seemed to me (with that 1400 mile through the TV psychic ability that I have) that the "I need to be home" light came on. Ergo, let's chalk this up to bad mechanic rather than blaming the "rim."

B,

I agree. The only reason I mentioned the "rim" mentality is that if the ball was in foul ground, that is the last place I am going as an umpire in this scenario. Only working the "rim" would an umpire attempt this in a rotation. Most others would have the umpire inside which in this case trying to navigate through the diamond could have been just as dangerous.

No mechanical rotation is based upon bad play. Sometimes, it is just better to stay pat and announce "2-umpire" to your crew.

IRISHMAFIA Fri May 29, 2009 09:20am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skahtboi (Post 605413)
Then maybe a)????? :D

Considering her resume, only if it was her first play of the tournament. Otherwise, no.

Big Slick Fri May 29, 2009 09:39am

Quote:

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA (Post 605416)
B,

I agree. The only reason I mentioned the "rim" mentality is that if the ball was in foul ground, that is the last place I am going as an umpire in this scenario. Only working the "rim" would an umpire attempt this in a rotation. Most others would have the umpire inside which in this case trying to navigate through the diamond could have been just as dangerous.

No mechanical rotation is based upon bad play. Sometimes, it is just better to stay pat and announce "2-umpire" to your crew.

"Working the rim" (a specific technique by U1 moving off the line on ball from CF to LF) is a specific case of not following a strict interpretation of the inside-outside theory. The SUIP allowed for this a few years ago, and when employed works wonderfully. However, some umpires use this too often. I see this concept/idea and the specific play at not being related.

I totally agree with your last paragraph, as this addresses the specific play. Weird plays call for the crew to communicate, react, and cover. PU in this case will see if U1 is stuck at first and can take the lead runner from third into home if necessary.

ronald Fri May 29, 2009 10:47am

Mike,

I got it now and do remember that play. Now I can use it as a learning experience with your "No mechanical rotation is based upon bad play. Sometimes, it is just better to stay pat and announce "2-umpire" to your crew."

I will also start to bring this type of play up in 3 man pre-game as something quite similar happened in a 3 man game I had the other day.

IRISHMAFIA Fri May 29, 2009 07:21pm

ASU-Wash
 
Anybody see the tag play at home in the bottom of the 4th?

I didn't notice which BU went out on the ball, I assume it was the umpire at 2B.

I would have the PU in a holding zone, not inside. Moving back outside behind the runner put her behind the play, but luckily the catcher made a nice grab and tag with plenty of time. And it helped that the runner's alleged slide was more of a tumble.

Was she where she was supposed to be? If so, the SUIP might want to take another look at that one.

wadeintothem Fri May 29, 2009 07:42pm

Is it me or was dive at the bag big time blown...

argodad Fri May 29, 2009 07:47pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by wadeintothem (Post 605565)
Is it me or was dive at the bag big time blown...

If you're talking about the "out" on UW's attempted steal of second ... it wasn't just you. :cool:

ronald Fri May 29, 2009 07:49pm

Bad call on steal in bottom of the 6th (I think).

I saw the play Mike and have to agree with reading the play 1st and not going inside the lines. Classic go to holding zone in ASA. Might be different in NCAA but as we can see the PU was not in the ideal position for the play at the plate.

Poor positioning on that play. She gets dinged by us.:D:D:

wadeintothem Fri May 29, 2009 08:01pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by ronald (Post 605567)
Bad call on steal in bottom of the 6th (I think).

I saw the play Mike and have to agree with reading the play 1st and not going inside the lines. Classic go to holding zone in ASA. Might be different in NCAA but as we can see the PU was not in the ideal position for the play at the plate.

Poor positioning on that play. She gets dinged by us.:D:D:

Well, we all trying to learn.

Some times we learn by horrible positioning. :D

That was pretty bad.

Thats a 3BL play IMO... for best positioning. But just about anything is better than chasing down the runner while shes scoring.

ronald Fri May 29, 2009 08:31pm

They are between games at the studio. They just showed Stacy Nelson getting a strike call where the ball is in the rh batters box. Unbelievable.

ronald Fri May 29, 2009 08:34pm

Exactly, Wade. We get to learn by seeing things on TV and get them in our mental box so when we have a similar play we already know what to do.

If you have a buddy and a video camera you could get them to film you. Great learning tool. They use it in the NBA and college conferences are going to it and they are teaching others that want to improve to get someone to film them and then break down the game after wards.

whiskers_ump Fri May 29, 2009 09:06pm

Noticed many of PU's leaving on right side when trailing BR, new mechanic?:confused:

wadeintothem Fri May 29, 2009 09:29pm

One thing I did notice, and this was something I had to work on.. very prominent tracking on obvious balls. I thought NCAA mechanic was not to track so prominently, especially on obvious balls. Its in the dirt and they are looking down.

They made it there; thats what I was told in eval though. Track on the close ones but when very obviously a ball, no need to have a lot of head movement - the purpose given was for TV and the way it looks.

IRISHMAFIA Fri May 29, 2009 09:46pm

Ouch!!!
 
Did I just see Traci Stoelting take a bat to the head?

ronald Fri May 29, 2009 10:54pm

Yes you did. did she seem to be hiding behind the batter? Her right foot was definitely not behind the cathcer on rh batters


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