I attempted to turn a double play last night and hit the runner point-blank in the forehead. The ball went into left field. The Umpire did not call interference because "the runner attempted to duck."

Was this the correct call?

You can't expect a runner to just disappear on a play such as this..........the umpire must judge that the interference be intentional on the part of the runner.

See ASA 8-8-J-4

Hope this helps.

Joel

Yeah, Joel; for sure the umpire must "judge".
He also must judge intent from the other end of the throw. ;)
mick

Very funny. This isn't the first time it has happened. I thought the runner had to make an attempt to get out of the base path after the force out. Ducking a head is not an attempt in my opinion (especially when they are taller than I am.)

I think your ump made the right call, but for the wrong reason. The runner doesn't have to "attempt to duck" or anything else, as long as he is doing what he would normally do to get to 2B and does not purposely interfere with the throw.

In Fed you might have interference without intent, but even then there's a debate about how close the runner has to be to the base.

Similarly, in ASA a runner can slide to break up a double play. In Fed, he can't really do that.

Quote:

Similarly, in ASA a runner can slide to break up a double play. In Fed, he can't really do that.

greymule,

Can you tell me what you base your Fed interpretation on?

Andy: I don't have the Fed book with me, but as I recall, a sliding runner must slide directly into the base. If he makes any contact beyond the base, it's an automatic double play, regardless of how safe he or the other runner is. He cannot slide to the side of the base and contact the fielder, even if a foot or arm could reach the base. He must have one buttock on the ground and no foot higher than the runner's something (knee?). If the fielder is standing in the base line directly in front of the base, then I guess the runner could slide in and upend him, but that's about the extent of the legal possibilities for "breaking up two." Just about every double play slide you see in the majors would be illegal in Fed.

Also, if he does not slide, he has to get out of the way, though there's some debate about how close he has to be to the base for the call to be made. Intent is not required for interference with the throw. So little of what we all used to think of as breaking up a double play is permitted in Fed.

Another reason I have retired from Fed.

greymule,
...And, after years of ASA and LL, I just got Fed registered in Softball. :cool:
mick

greymule...........

I believe the interp you are using is for FED baseball...........the FPSR (force play slide rule).......

I don't think this is used in SB.........

Joel

Joel: You might be right. In my last post, I was going to add that I was assuming Fed's softball rule to be at least as strict as their baseball rule. There may well be a difference.

Well, I'm home now, so I will look it up.

And Mick: Best of luck to you. Some of my friends ump Fed softball and love it, so don't let me rain on your parade!

Joel is correct that is the BB ruling, no so in Softball.

Rule 2 Sec 52 A1...

Mick, I also wish you luck and know that you will enjoy it.

glen

The Fed softball and baseball slide definitions are not quite identical. Both define a legal slide as "within reach of the base with either a hand or a foot," but softball adds "when the slide is completed." Both prohibit a rolling or cross-body slide, but baseball also includes the pop-up slide. And baseball adds the provision about sliding in a direct line between the two bases on a force play.

In either sport, an illegal slide causes the runner to be out not only if contact is made, but also if the slide alters the actions of the fielder in the immediate act of making a play.

ASA is not nearly so strict. I can't find anything in ASA about sliding past the base, sliding in a direct line, pop-up slides, even altering the actions of the fielder. In fact, ASA doesn't even define "slide," legal or illegal. Apparently, it all falls under "interference" and the various interpretations there.

My 30+ years in ASA lead me to believe that slides and breaking up double plays are handled very much like OBR. Last year in ASA slow pitch, I did work with a BU who called a double play when a runner slid to the left of 2B (but within reach) and made routine contact with the fielder, even though the batter had the play at 1B beaten. The offense of course thought the BU was insane, but so did the defense. I'll go through the ASA case book today to see what I can find.