Fed....
1. Is there a quick and easy way to analyze the BOO situation. Correct it and get on with the game?
2. Are there any stategies used by defensive coaches when recognizing a BOO error?
We discussed Question #1 for a bit at our association's meeting last night.... Ran out of time... But, sometimes I leave more confused than when I arrived...

Is this what you meant?

1) Has a pitch been thrown to the next batter? Forget it and move on.

2) Is the batter who is out of order still at bat? Correct it and move on.

3) Has the batter who was out of order completed her turn, but no pitch has been thrown to the next batter? Assess the penalty. Bring up the now correct batter, and move on.

The real "meat" is in #3, but since I don't have an NFHS book, and since ASA is different I think wrt which outs stand, the NFHS guys will need to fill that in.

Most coaches will rely on their scorekeeper to let them know about a BOO. They will wait until they think they will get the out before appealing the BOO. However, a fair percentage of the time they screw this part up and miss the out.

One coach who posts regularly on the softball boards will look to see who is coming to bat after the BOO, and if that player would also be out of order once the original BOO play is left to stand, he may wait one more at bat. So when he finally appeals, you have a bit more of a mess to sort through as to who is the correct legal batter.

Fed penalty for BOO = Proper batter out. Outs obtained on play stand with the exception that the out for BOO superseeds an out made by improper batter. Return runners to TOP base(last pitch of at bat). Next batter is batter who follows the retired proper batter.

(Thats about as short as I can make it)

Roger Greene

Yeah, you Fed guys don't get those extra outs like we do in ASA :)

Dakota,
You say " One coach who posts regularly on the softball boards will look to see who is coming to bat after the BOO, and if that player would also be out of order once the original BOO play is left to stand, he may wait one more at bat. So when he finally appeals, you have a bit more of a mess to sort through as to who is the correct legal batter."

If first batter out of order complets turn at bat and a pitch legal or illegal has been thrown does this not make the next batter the proper batter?

Mike,
I've been told Fed used to use that rule for baseball and softball. I think they changed it because so many coaches got ejected when you had 3 outs and only two batters! ! !

Terry,
You are correct. The only real mess comes up when the correct batter is still on base when her turn to bat occures. (Just leave her on base and skip her turn.)

Roger Greene

Can't help it if they can't count. There are three batters, it's just that one forgot to bat :)

A couple of years ago when this first hit ASA rules, I had this call in the first or second game of the season.

B1 got a single. B2 too busy talking to girlfriend. B3 hits into a double play. When B4 comes to the plate, the opposing manager protests that B3 batted out of order.

Sure enough, I had three outs on two pitches. Now, those are my type of half-innings!

The thing to remember in any BOO situation is that you nly have to consider the last two batters wwho have received at least 1 pitch. If the last batter to receive a pitch is the batter listed after the next-to-last batter to receive a pitch then there is no BOO.

Consider the following scenario:<ul><li>B1 bats and walks,<li>B3 bats and strikes out. -- If the defense appeals here, B3 is BOO and B2 is called out. In ASA, you have 2 outs and B4 is the proper batter; in FED, you have 1 out and B3 is the proper batter,<li>B2 comes to bat and walks -- if the defense appeals here, B2 is BOO since the 1st pitch to B2 legalized B3's turn, making B4 the proper batter. In both ASA and FED, B4 is declared out and B5 is the proper batter,<li>B4 comes to bat and hits a double, scoring B1 and B2, but is thrown out trying for 3rd -- if the defense appeals here, B4 is BOO since the pitch to B4 legalized B2's at-bat making B3 the proper batter. In ASA, you have B4 out on the play, B3 out for the BOO, 3 outs and no runs score; in FED you have B3 out on the BOO appeal, B1 and B2 return to their TOP bases, and B4 bats again with 2 outs,<li>B5 comes to bat and walks -- since the 1st pitch to B4 legalized B4's turn, B5 is the proper batter and all the nonsence that went on before is water under the bridge, no appeal for BOO will be recognized.</ul>

Believe it or not, getting two batters switched is a fairly common BOO infraction. I had one game where it a coach told the #2 and #3 batter to switch, but didn't change the line-up card. They batted that way throughout the entire game until the 6th inning when the series of events described above occured. The defensive coaches finally figured it out. Unfortunately they didn't appeal until after the 1st pitch to B5. They ended up losing 2-0.

SamC

What this coach was looking for was two batters switching places. B1, B3, B2...

Once the first pitch is thrown to B2, B3's at bat is legal, so the correct batter up is B4, so B2 is also BOO.