3 New Rules Learned This Weekend
 

1. It cannot be a foul ball if the 3rd baseman is clearly standing in fair
territory and touches the ball when over foul ground.

2. It is interference when a runner has to dodge the bat left lying on the
ground. Batter hit a shot to center field, burning her and going to fence.
Rounding third, sees HER bat, slows, goes wide around the bat, and is
thrown out at home. Not even a close play.

3. If while trying to run to 1st after D3K runner falls, gets up and heads
towards 1B well out of running lane to fair side. Catcher got the ball back
on bounce, [backstop only 8' from home plate], Attempting to throw the
BR out, hits her about five feet from 1B, single base. Interference cannot
be called because the run fell. [This play got very heated., I don't know
why.]

C'mon....who were the umpires, DwiddleeeeDumb and his brother IamDumber?

Michael, I think you are not seeing the picture. Glen was the umpire; these are rules that the coaches argued.

Oh, come on now. I believe we have covered this many times before. This is one of the very basic rules in the coaches rule book. Also, you are aware that you cannot call it a fair ball when the player is clearly standing in foul territory and touches the ball in fair territory. Also, if the player touches the ball in fair territory, and falls with it into foul territory then drops the ball, it is a foul ball.

Have you not read the rule on bat obstruction?

I believe this is a judgement call. :D

Guess it was not that clear. But Steve is correct. Coaches of 16U teams.

Too embarrased to mention the association.

Last year, had a coach eject himself who would not let this coaches rule go. He was in my face demanding that I describe for him the exact position of his players feet when she touched the ball... I did not know that position, because I was focussed on the ball (sharp grounder down 3b line), not his fielders feet.

16U A .. ASA.

I'm sure that "in her cleats, coach, but that's irrelevant" would have been accurate, but also inflamatory. :cool:

Not relevant, the coach wanted bat interference! :p :rolleyes: :D

Hold on now! Are you trying to tell me it is supposed to be "foul player" and not "foul ball"? ;) ;) :p :D

Extra winks for Michael ;) ;) :D :p

I think it was some pianist and a guy from the baseball forum. :eek:

Hey! Double fist pumps for Dave! :eek:

Speaking of pianists...

A guy walks into a bar and sees a guy playing the piano...the guy is only a foot high. He goes over to the pianist and asks him how he got to be only a foot high.

The 12-inch tall pianist says, "A hard of hearing genie."

Thanks for the clarification. It never ceases to amaze me what will come out of a coach's mouth.

And believe it or not, this rule came back to bite me on the butt not once, but twice last night. Working a varsity for two small (literally one horse, well 1A) schools. First one was a hard shot down the third base line, fielder, with one foot in foul territory fields it cleanly in fair territory (not on the line.) I of course, being the dummy umpire that I am, signal fair ball. BR safe on errant throw. After the inning was over, I hear the coach of the then offensive team tell his player, "you got a lucky break on that one. It should have been a foul. She was in foul territory." (Not a word about the wild throw that F5 made!)

Then toward the end of this "epic" match-up, had another shot by the same team down the first base side. F3, with, you guessed it, a foot in foul territory fields the ball on the line and gets the out. This time, same coach as before, comes out to argue. I tried to explain to him that it is not where the fielder is standing, but where the ball is first touched that matters in determining whether it is fair or foul. He will have none of it, and leaves our conversation with the old "you have been getting that wrong all night." (All night? On two calls???)

Anyway, to add to this humor, I hear two dads arguing in the stands behind me. One is taking the approach of "it is where the fielder stands that matters," while the other is taking the correct approach. They get louder and louder, and for a moment I thought that a fight was going to break out between the two of them. Crazy.

LOL... Inflamatory maybe, but the first chance I can use that line I'm gonna use it! :cool: Then of course explain it's where the ball was when it touched the fielders glove, not where the fielders feet are. Fun at the ole' ball park! ...Al

omg.... ok im gullible. I looked up the rule. damn sarcasm. :D

Here is another to add to the list. I had a runner going to first last night, ran the entire distance in fair territory, on a shallow hit to right field. Throw comes in from outfielder and hits the runner after she had crossed first base. Coach came out and asked if the runner was not in fair territory, and I agreed with him that she was. He said, "so she's out, isn't she?" I said, "no coach, that is only if she interferes with a throw." His reply?? "Well the ball hit her, didn't you see it?"

My jaw nearly hit the ground. I thought, then, that maybe he was just kidding, but he kept asking me to go to my partner for help. I tried to explain how the rule works to him, but I just don't think he believed me.

You will not work AA ball, but you will deal with this stupidity.:confused:

Well, as a rule it is a little more rare to encounter this type of stupidity. Most coaches around these parts have a fairly good grasp on the rules. I have just been really lucky the past two nights working for the "Bubba" coaches who don't know how to spell "rule book" let alone read one. (And oddly enough, both of them are big players in the SP leagues around here.)

3 Rules ?
 

I'm confused. What rules are you using here? We use ISF rules.

"1. It cannot be a foul ball if the 3rd baseman is clearly standing in fair
territory and touches the ball when over foul ground."

No, the fair-foul goes according to the ball, not the player. If the ball is in fair or foul "airspace", that's what determines the call.

ISF Rule 1 Sec. 29. FAIR BALL.
A fair ball is a legally batted ball which
a. Settles or is touched on or over fair territory between home and first base or between home and third base. . . .

"2. It is interference when a runner has to dodge the bat left lying on the
ground. . . . "

Interference results in an out. I believe he wanted "obstruction". But obstruction is a violation of the defense. How can the defense be charged with obstruction when it was the offense that put the bat there in the first place?

"3. If while trying to run to 1st after D3K runner falls, gets up and heads
towards 1B well out of running lane to fair side. Catcher got the ball back
on bounce, [backstop only 8' from home plate], Attempting to throw the
BR out, hits her about five feet from 1B, single base. Interference cannot
be called because the run fell. [This play got very heated., I don't know
why.]"

Too bad there was only one base, but the play was made from foul territory. In this case, had there been a safety base, the rights to the bases are reversed. And what does the runner falling have to do with anything?

ISA Rule 2, Sec.h:
h. BASES
. . .
NOTE: THE FOLLOWING RULES APPLY TO THE DOUBLE BASE:
. . .
EXCEPTION: On any live ball play made from first base foul territory, the batter-runner and the
defensive player may use either base. When the defensive player uses the foul portion of the double
base, the batter-runner can run in fair territory and if hit by a throw from the foul side of first base, it
would not be interference.

WARNING: Sarcasm In Use In This Thread
 

The OP was not serious. He was being sarcastic. Or maybe even facetious. He was listing "rules" that the coaches he was dealing with "know," but aren't in any rulebook. I thought that this had been covered in previous replies.

I had been kind of worried that a newbie might wander by and not know he was joking, but I didn't expect it of any experienced members.

Nothing to be confused about- if you read all of the respnses in this thread! Glen, the umpire, was being sarcastic about "learning" these new rules. They were all examples of arguments offered by coaches who, obviously, had no understanding of the rules.

Do they celebrate April Fool's Day in Israel? ;)

Not a season goes by where I don't get a couple of these arguments: On a foul tip- "Isn't that foul/doesn't she have to go back?"; On an appeal for leaving early- "Isn't that a force out?"; On a batter hit by a pitch- "Aren't the hands part of the bat?".

Those rule myths have been around forever and will probably be around for a long time to come. But every once in awhile, a coach will come up with one you haven't heard before!

Here are a few that stick out from my past couple of seasons:

- Strike three swinging. Pitch is low, but catcher makes a good catch of the pitch, while her glove is in contact with the dirt.

Coach argues that since the catcher's mitt was touching the ground, it wasn't a legal catch and should be regarded as an uncaught third strike!

- Batter hits ball to F4, who bobbles and allows batter to safely reach first without a throw. Instead of throwing the ball back to the pitcher, F4 picks up the ball and walks into the pitching circle.

While F4 is still holding the ball, and apparently apologizing to her pitcher for blowing the play, runner at first alertly scoots down to second base.

Coach wants Look Back Rule violation called because "the ball was in the circle"!

- Batter swings at pitch and whacks catcher's mitt (catcher had been setting up real close to the plate all day).

Defensive coach starts screaming, "You gotta call that, Blue!". She seems to think that this is some sort of infraction or unsportsmanlike move by the batter!

"Sure thing, coach. I'm about to call it. That's obstruction! Batter, take your base!".

- Okay, this one was from FED baseball, but you have to admit it was pretty creative!

With runner on first, pitcher begins his pitch to the plate, then stops mid-delivery. "That's a balk!" (and dead ball in FED).

Pitcher then fakes a throw to first base while still in contact with the rubber (which is really moot at that point, as the ball is already dead).

Coach wants TWO balks called and argues that his runner on first should be awarded TWO bases!

I did tell him, "Coach, you get an A+ for creativity, but an F- for understanding the balk rule!".

LOL The same thing happen to me in a game about three years ago. The coach got so heated he was begging me to ask the other umpire if she had seen where the feet were located when his player touched the foul ball. He got so upset that he wanted to protest the game and was not going to leave the field. Worse call he had ever seen and I was taking the game away from the kids.
Needless to say he called everyone he could think of after the game- found out he was wrong- and (thank goodness) still will not even say a word to me because "I" threw him out.
And he was the one that was wrong and acted like a clown. But it is my fault.
Oh well, the joys of umpiring.

"Do you have Rule Book, Coach? Well take it along to the car and read it, because you are done out here."

Apparently, facetiousness is not as clear when in writing and when maybe American is not your native language. :o
Let's be considerate of such things. :cool: :)

Actually, American English is my native language, I just didn't get the sarcasm, that's all.

Have fun:)