The Official Forum - When is a bunt not a bunt?

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- - When is a bunt not a bunt? (https://forum.officiating.com/softball/2995-when-bunt-not-bunt.html)

Had this happen in a 12U tournament yesterday (ASA JO).

B1 has 2 strike count. She squares to bunt. Pitch comes way inside -- right at batter's legs. Batter turns and steps back, bringing the bat down and back toward the catcher. Batter is facing away from the infield when the ball hits the bat and goes foul.

I call foul ball, count stays at 2 strikes. Defensive coach wants batter out, but rule 7-6G says When the batter bunts foul after the second strike... and POE 9 says, in considering whether the batter swung to consider Did he make an attempt to hit the pitch?.

I ruled that while she did square to bunt, she was no longer making an attempt to hit the pitch, and she did not hit the ball foul while bunting, but while trying to get out of the way of the errant pitch.

Did I kick it?

(PS - my partner thought I did. He said once she squared to bunt, it was a foul while bunting. We discussed this after the game because he - my partner - told the coach I was wrong before the coach came to talk to me. I was not pleased.)

[Edited by Dakota on Oct 1st, 2001 at 02:02 PM]

Definitely gotta see that one, but, more importantly, your partner owes you an apology. That's your judgement call and your partner has no business saying anything to anyone until you ask him a specific question. Partner actions like that make everyone look bad. From your description, sounds like the pitch hit the bat while the batter trying to get out of the way - I've got just aothe foul there with count staying at 1 & 2.

How does the Softball rule defining "bunt" read?

In baseball, OBR, rule 2.00 BUNT it clearly says " . . intentionally met . . " In baseball this was not intentionally met, thus not a bunt, thus not an out.

From your description of the situation, you made the right call. Your partner is an unprofessional jackass, and I would ask to not be assigned with him'her again.

Bob

Bob:

I am afraid that I gotta agree with the previous assessments of your partner. Guys like him we don't need. Incidentally, I would have made the same call that you made, so no, you didn't kick it. Good call.

Rich:

Most rule books for softball read the same way, saying that the ball must be intentionally met with the bat.

Scott

Quote:

Originally posted by Dakota
Had this happen in a 12U tournament yesterday (ASA JO).

B1 has 2 strike count. She squares to bunt. Pitch comes way inside -- right at batter's legs. Batter turns and steps back, bringing the bat down and back toward the catcher. Batter is facing away from the infield when the ball hits the bat and goes foul.

I call foul ball, count stays at 2 strikes. Defensive coach wants batter out, but rule 7-6G says When the batter bunts foul after the second strike... and POE 9 says, in considering whether the batter swung to consider Did he make an attempt to hit the pitch?.

I ruled that while she did square to bunt, she was no longer making an attempt to hit the pitch, and she did not hit the ball foul while bunting, but while trying to get out of the way of the errant pitch.

Did I kick it?

(PS - my partner thought I did. He said once she squared to bunt, it was a foul while bunting. We discussed this after the game because he - my partner - told the coach I was wrong before the coach came to talk to me. I was not pleased.)

[Edited by Dakota on Oct 1st, 2001 at 02:02 PM]

Tell your partner to finally open his rule book to page 46 and read the definition of BUNT:

"A bunt is a ball that is intentionally tapped with the bat, slowly, within the infield. A bunt shold never be considered and infield fly."

After reading the definition to him, ask him to turn to page 98 and check out rule 8.6.G (BATTER IS OUT): (Fast Pitch only) When the batter bunts foul after the second strike. If the ball is caught in the air, it remains live and in play."

Please point out to your former partner that the verb in the defining sentence is "bunts". Not "attempt", not "squared to", but it states the ball must be bunted which requires intentional contact with the ball.

BTW, you might want to have another talk with the coach with rule book in hand so there is no misunderstanding the next time this happens.

Quote:

After reading the definition to him, ask him to turn to page 98 and check out rule 8.6.G (BATTER IS OUT): (Fast Pitch only) When the batter bunts foul after the second strike. If the ball is caught in the air, it remains live and in play."

Did I say 8.6.G? Damn! I obviously meant to refer to 7.6.G.

Looks like a consensus. When you remove your foot from your partner's backside, tell him that he at least owes you one of the frosty adult beverages.

NCAA Fastpitch Ruling Needed.

I know several of you do NCAA, so I have a question.
Is it a strike according to NCAA rules if batter is
attmpting to bunt and leaves the bat over the plate
and the ball is out of the strike zone? {And I mean
this was really out of strike zone}.

I realize that in most softball rule books, an attempt
to bunt, is when the batter moves the bat towards the ball,
a strike is not called if the ball is out of the zone.
and the batter leaves the bat over the plate [zone}.
In NCAA must the bat must be withdrawn - pulled backward
and away from zone and if not, would this be considered
a strike regarless of location of ball?

Pre-Thanks,

glen

Glen,
Technically, yes, that's still considered "striking" at the ball. But I have not ever seen that happen. College players are aware of the need to pull the bat back and they do. They do not have to move it far, just so they have moved it back or are moving it back.