Same old same old

CLBuffalo · #1 (**permalink**) Fri May 19, 2006, 11:46pm

Rec league game. Dixie Youth (12U). I'm PU.

Batted ball hits the plate first and goes up the 1st base line in fair territory. 1st base person fields it in fair territory. I signal fair ball. 1st base person steps on 1st before the batter-runner gets there. BU calls the out. BR, coach and fans yell and scream that it's a foul ball because it hit the plate first.

Batter has 2 strikes on her. She swings on pitched ball. I initially thought it hit the bat. I call and signal foul ball. Batter is holding her hand and looks in pain. Offensive coach and fans say the ball hit her hand and she should get 1st base. I asked the coach if he was sure it hit her hand and not the bat. He said yes. I said ok and called the batter out. Fans are unhappy and are yelling at the call. Coach looks at me for a few seconds and then realizes what he has done. He tells the batter she is indeed out. (I might have lucked out on this one.)

Bases loaded with 2 outs. Batter hit fly ball to 3rd base side of infield in fair territory. 3rd base person camps under it but drops it. R1 scores and bases are loaded again. Defensive coach and fans want IFR called.

What really gets me sometimes is not just that they get mad and upset at some calls but they get madder and more upset when they find out the umpire is right and they are wrong. I'm seriously thinking of asking the rec director to post signs listing softball myths and misconceptions. Probably wouldn't do any good though.

Az.Ump · #2 (**permalink**) Sat May 20, 2006, 01:12am

"I'm seriously thinking of asking the rec director to post signs listing softball myths and misconceptions. Probably wouldn't do any good though."

"But a Nook can't read, so a Nook can't cook."

Paul

JEL · #3 (**permalink**) Sat May 20, 2006, 07:28am

"I'm seriously thinking of asking the rec director to post signs listing softball myths and misconceptions. Probably wouldn't do any good though."

I did copy the "MURSA" rules that Joel developed. I take a couple of copies and hang on the bulletin board at the park every so often. They get taken and I hope read, but the myths still persist! That's a good list to put up if the rec dept will. I didn't ask, just did it!

CLBuffalo · #4 (**permalink**) Sat May 20, 2006, 12:09pm

Does anyone know where i can get a copy of the MURSA rules? Couldn't find them on Google. Thanks.

SC Ump · #5 (**permalink**) Sat May 20, 2006, 05:43pm

One is at http://www.umpire.org/writers/jb2.html

CLBuffalo · #6 (**permalink**) Sat May 20, 2006, 06:03pm

Thank you SC Ump.

The only misconception I don't understand is:

19. It is a strike on a check swing if the batter breaks his/her wrists.

Any help on this from anyone is greatly appreciated.

SC Ump · #7 (**permalink**) Sat May 20, 2006, 09:34pm

It is a strike if the umpire judges that a batter attempted to swing / bunt the ball. There are several guides the umpire can use to make that judgement, like did the bat go past the plate or did the batter "break" his/her wrist. However, the ultimate decission relies only on whether the umpire judged that the batter made an attempt.

(I believe there is an NCAA ruling that might be seen as an exception on a bunt. I've read on this bulletin board that NCAA judges that if a player holds the bat over the plate on a bunt and does not pull it back, then they have attempted. I do not know of other organizations have this stipulation.)

tcblue13 · #8 (**permalink**) Sat May 20, 2006, 11:32pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by SC Ump

It is a strike if the umpire judges that a batter attempted to swing / bunt the ball. There are several guides the umpire can use to make that judgement, like did the bat go past the plate or did the batter "break" his/her wrist. However, the ultimate decission relies only on whether the umpire judged that the batter made an attempt.

(I believe there is an NCAA ruling that might be seen as an exception on a bunt. I've read on this bulletin board that NCAA judges that if a player holds the bat over the plate on a bunt and does not pull it back, then they have attempted. I do not know of other organizations have this stipulation.)

For what it is worth, I heard a commentator in the Michigan Oklahoma game that it is considered a swing if the bat breaks the plane of the plate. Maybe you NCAA guys could respond as to whether that is the case. I probably would not call a check swing that the bat did not at least make it to perpendicular to the batter's body.

AtlUmpSteve · #9 (**permalink**) Sun May 21, 2006, 09:02am

Quote:

Originally Posted by tcblue13

For what it is worth, I heard a commentator in the Michigan Oklahoma game that it is considered a swing if the bat breaks the plane of the plate. Maybe you NCAA guys could respond as to whether that is the case. I probably would not call a check swing that the bat did not at least make it to perpendicular to the batter's body.

There is nothing different in the NCAA rules or umpire manual about what constitutes a swing (other than the already stated bunt exception, requiring a batter to pull back a squared bat). The same guidelines as anywhere else.

My personal point of no return is when the bat head has advanced to the point that contact with the ball could result in a fair ball; that is a swing. I hardly look at the batter's hands or movements; I watch the bat head.

CLBuffalo · #10 (**permalink**) Sun May 21, 2006, 01:31pm

Thanks to all for the responses. I don't think anyone got the question I was asking. According to MURSA misconception #19 It is a strike on a check swing if the batter breaks his/her wrists.

My question is when is it NOT a strike on a check swing when a batter breaks his/her wrists? Is this a typo? Should it read 19. It is not a strike on a check swing if the batter breaks his/her wrists.

SC Ump · #11 (**permalink**) Sun May 21, 2006, 01:45pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by CLBuffalo

My question is when is it NOT a strike on a check swing when a batter breaks his/her wrists?

Even if the batter breaks her wrist, but the umpire judges that she did not attempt at the ball, then it is still a ball. What we were saying is that "breaking the wrist" is only a guide.

Breaking the wrist does not make it a strike, nor does it make it a ball. Breaking the wrist is not the determining factor. The only determining factor is "did the umpire think there was an attempt to hit the ball."

Hope that helps explain it better.

CecilOne · #12 (**permalink**) Sun May 21, 2006, 02:29pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by SC Ump

Even if the batter breaks her wrist, but the umpire judges that she did not attempt at the ball, then it is still a ball. What we were saying is that "breaking the wrist" is only a guide.

Breaking the wrist does not make it a strike, nor does it make it a ball. Breaking the wrist is not the determining factor. The only determining factor is "did the umpire think there was an attempt to hit the ball."

Hope that helps explain it better.

The other side of that coin is that there are other "guides". IOW, the batter doesn't have to "break the wrists" to be a strike. Easiest example to visualize is a bunt attempt. The myth arises from coaches/players begging that it couldn't be a strike because the batter didn't ....

CLBuffalo · #13 (**permalink**) Sun May 21, 2006, 03:05pm

Thanks to all. I've got it now.