The Official Forum - Automatic Obstruction?

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Deb -

I'm in Israel.

For McCrowder -

The ISF rule is, RULE 1 :

Sec. 53. OBSTRUCTION.
Obstruction is the act of
a. A defensive player or team member that hinders or prevents a batter from striking or hitting a pitched ball.
b. A fielder, while
1. not in possession of the ball, or
2. not in the act of fielding a batted ball,
which impedes the progress of a runner or batter-runner that is legally running bases.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shmuelg

which impedes the progress of a runner or batter-runner that is legally running bases.

If you have any further problems, simply point to this statement.

No impediment, no obstruction.

Quote:

Originally Posted by CecilOne

Tom, If you object to my posting your editorial, say so and I'll take it off.

No problem... ;)

Quote:

Originally Posted by mcrowder

Maybe you could quote the ISF rule for us, so we can see if it differs from FED or ASA. These two rules are exceedingly clear in the fact that a runner must actually be impeded in some way for obstruction to occur.

ISF requires the runner be impeded.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shmuelg

Yes, another obstruction question.

Sitch (this really happened last week):
(ISF rules)

R1 on 1st, R2 on 2nd. 2 outs. Batting team behind by 3. Batter hits strong line drive to right. R2 comes around third, starts for home. I (the PU), set up about 2 ft up the line to 3rd, and about 4 ft. behind the line (comments on this mechanic at the end, please, this is not my main question).

Ball is thrown in (strong, straight throw) from right field, and the catcher sets up about 2ft towards third base, either ON the 3B-HP baseline, or just to the fair side of the baseline (I am not sure, mea culpa). R2 comes in at full speed, doesn't slow down, doesn't try to avoid catcher. No collision. Ball comes in *just* before runner (who is *not* sliding, go figure), catcher turns around very quickly, and tags B2 out. I call OUT, selling the call like Cal Worthington. 3 outs.

Offensive coach doesn't like this call (duh), and comes out to dispute it. I have to listen, and he asks me in my opinion, where was the catcher? I say it doesn't matter, as in my opinion, the catcher did not obstruct the runner, because the runner did not slow down, and did not avoid the catcher, and there was no collision. And he looks at me incredulously, saying "Are you saying that it doesn't matter if the catcher was in the baseline?" And I say "yes, because in my opinion, the runner was not obstructed." I say that because he didn't slow down, and didn't avoid the catcher, and there was no collision.

So, the offensive coach claims that if the catcher is in the basepath without the ball, then BY DEFINITION, it is obstruction. I say, no, it depends if the runner is affected by that positioning or not. In my opinion, the runner was NOT affected by that. Offensive coach says in that case, the game is being played under protest (this was erased at the end of the game, because they went on to win), because of incorrect interpretation of the rules.

What do y'all say here? Is being in the base path sans ball an *automatic* obstruction call? Or does it depend on the situation, and it's a judgement call?

And - should I have had my mask on in this case as a safety precaution, or take it off to see the play better?

Thanks,

Shmuel Goldstein
Israel Softball Association

I'm one of the new umpires, who really enjoys learning from a group of well imformed and experienced umpires on this board.

It seems clear to me, without a runner being impeded (as a requirement by rule) there is no grounds to call obstruction. A runners basebath could be well wide of a direct path to the plate, or with any other base, as it appears to be the case here. Good call, or I should say good non-call! ..Al

P.S. First T-Ball game last night...One kid hit the ball off the Tee, then ran toward the middle of the field and picked it up... :) LOL! Gotta love them kids!

A somewhat related question. Let's say a fielder/catcher is repeatedly blocking the base/plate w/o the ball, but not impeding runners. Is it coaching or is it preventive officiating to suggest the fielder/catcher stop doing it?

Cecil - how old?

Younger groups, yes - I'll say something to them the first time, as this can be an eventual safety issue.

Older, no - they need to know on their own, and if I coach one kid not to do it, and then later the other team's catcher actually obstructs, I've unfairly affected the game.

Quote:

Originally Posted by CecilOne

Good question, Cecil. I was a catcher my entire time playing from minor league, major league (little league) and through high school. I didn't place myself directly in front of the plate until I got the ball in my mitt. Even at the high school level I never had a coach tell me I couldn't be there without the ball if a runner was coming in wide of the plate. I guess the coaches were either thinking it may be considered an automatic OBS by some umpires, or they knew the risk that a smart runner would make sure it was obstruction. So I would say an umpire should stay clear of preventive officiating and let the chips fall where the players dictate. I think a good coach would advise his catcher to avoid setting up directly in front of the plate until he/she has the ball. That's probably why it's a rare thing. Coaches probably realize there's a better than equal chance that obstruction will be called, especially with good base runners. ...Al

P.S. In another T-Ball game one batter/runner must have thought the safest way to avoid throwing the bat was to take it with him all the way to first base! His grandparents liked that one... :) Another kid walked off from the Tee after missing the ball by several inches on the first two swings. He went to go find another bat. He didn't care what dugout it came from. His grandfather said: "Hey ump he needs another bat that one had two holes in it...Fun at the ole' ball park! ..

Al, two things.

Baseball mentality doesn't permit for common sense ;) Just kidding. However, in baseball, catchers are almost expected to block the plate and take one for the team if necessary. I know the game is moving away from that at the youth level, but you still have some old school guys coaching.

Your association has enough umpires that they cover t-ball games? Damn, send some my way!!!

<b>the offensive coach claims that if the catcher is in the basepath without the ball, then BY DEFINITION, it is obstruction.</b>

I've heard that one countless times.