Middle school softball

Runner on 3rd, 2 outs. Dropped 3rd strike on batter. Batter starts running to first as runner on third comes home. Catcher tosses to pitcher who tags runner coming home -- for the 3rd out.

When the team comes to bat the next inning, the same batter who had the dropped 3rd strike comes to bat.

Question:
Should that batter be considered batting out of order since she struck out the inning before, but the out was actually made on girl coming home?

Or -- did the throw need to go first to get the batter out and not the runner coming home for the final out?

Blue called batter batting out of order once scorekeeper questioned prior inning. Did Blue make right call the inning before?

I hope I explained this OK. Any insight would be appreciated.

Scorebook will show put out of the runner from third and batter is "left on base" at first. You are correct that they would be batting out of order if they attempted to start the next inning. There turn at bat was over when they became the batter-runner, at the time the ball was dropped.

"Blue called batter batting out of order once scorekeeper questioned prior inning. Did Blue make right call the inning before?"

Scorekeepers may not appeal BOO. Only managers/coaches may. When a scorekeeper approached me, I ignored him/her. "That's the coach's job, not your's".

In your scenario, the batter had completed her turn at bat.

Bob

Agrre with SCump
BR had completed their turn at bat .
Agree with Blue Zebra about the appeal regarding scorer .
I hope it wasnt a scorer assigned to the game as well and therefore an official .
Need details when the appeal was made as this is very important .

This is the one instruction I give scorekeeper - BOO is coaches call. If you catch it, just track it. Don't say anything.

How can you guys tell a score keeper that?

They usually are a parent of kid or a kid on the team itself in rec-varsity. maybe you guys are talking about higher levels.

That is HOW the coach catches it, by the score keeper not being able to figure out who is at bat.

No coach sits there and checks every batter with the score keepr.. its not even reasonable to say that to a coach or score keeper IMO.

The scorekeeper says something and it gets checked out by coach/umpire. Thats how its done.

There is nothing wrong with a team scorekeeper keeping the coach informed of the situation. The coach needs to make the appeal, however.

Official scorekeepers (game officials) need to keep quiet, but not the parent/assistant coach/bench player who is keeping the team's book.

Of course, this is true .. but we are talking about middle school softball.

the chances the score keeper is some paid official is slim to none.

Coaches officially make the appeal, which is what basically happens when the score keeper says "wait a minute, wrong person is up" and are confused.

I felt the need to inject some reality as some blues began to wander from the subject - help for a Middle School Ump. This wasnt NCAA Div 1.. its most likely some mom keeping score.


The "official" keeper is usually the home team. They can say something as much as the "unofficial" visiting mom score keeper.



[Edited by wadeintothem on May 2nd, 2005 at 11:57 AM]

And I always tells these home-team mom's that they cannot call attention to anything that looks funny. If coach wants someone to watch for that, it can't be MY scorekeeper.

Maybe you have reasoning behind doing this that I dont know so I'll take this opportunity to learn something new.

Based on what rule do you silence this scorekeeper?

If your scorekeeper is a home-team mom, then someone you have in an official capacity (essentially, someone who's supposed to be impartial) should not be in position to act only in one team's favor. Since I find it extremely unlikely that a home-team-mom scorekeeper would yell over to the visitor's team to alert them to a chance to get an out, it's not fair for them to be able to do so for the home team either. In fact, they are in a position to stop the BOO for the home team before a penalty is the result, if they are allowed to pipe up whenever they want. Neither situation is fair.

They are an official. They must remain impartial.

You have some good points.. its just so often the scorekeeper is some injured player on the bench, the 1B coach or whatever.. for total equity, it seems odd to selectively choose when to be hard and fast about this.

I do agree that normally, a score keeper should be silent. If the school/NFHS want this enforced to its full effect, they should hire a score keeper to be an official and disallow what I normally have. I cant walk around telling mothers of players, benched players and coaches to be quiet about an error and expect them to do that. Its just not reasonable. The visiting mom will have to handle the other side in most cases IMO.

But you have good points.

[Edited by wadeintothem on May 2nd, 2005 at 02:03 PM]

I'm not selective. It's 100%. If my scorekeeper is an injured player or whatever, they are sitting behind me, and they get the speech too (perhaps even more clearly than an adult might, even). When they are sitting behind me, they are working for me.

And yes, I HAVE ejected a scorekeeper for crossing the line. (Well, not an actual EJECTION, per se, more of a removal from office if you will.)

Its an interesting view.. never seen it made an issue of. Normally between the visitors mom and home mom, neither of whom i put much stock in one over the other, it all gets figured out (in fact I usually go an talk to which ever team is winning so i dont have to deal with the attitude of the one losing).

its definately food for thought though.

At a minimum, you are consistent.

I'm curious. What happens when Visitor mom is saying BOO, and Home mom is saying she's wrong? How do you unravel it?