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-   -   Runner Deception?? (https://forum.officiating.com/softball/19093-runner-deception.html)

emaxos Sun Mar 13, 2005 08:00am

I think I know how this will go but have to ask anyway.
R1 on first, 0 out.
BR pops up in infield, between 1st and pitcher's circle, infielders converge. R1, three or four strides toward 2nd, joins the chorus yelling, "I got it".
Pitcher, 2nd base get confused and ball drops in. Both runners safe. Fielders admitted afterwards, runner screaming fooled them.
I've seen mention on here rules about intentionally attempting to deceive. Any possibility that the runner's actions were illegal?
Neither runner scored and we won 11-3 so only impact was fielder's looking stupid.


debeau Sun Mar 13, 2005 01:11pm

Deception
 
Dead ball interference runner is out and as this interference in my judgement is to prevent a second out then batter runner is also out .

NorthAlaUmp Sun Mar 13, 2005 05:46pm

Absolutely illegal in NFHS. Interference on R1, she's out.

I don't know that I would go so far as to call the B/R out also, since it is not clear R1 would have been put out if the ball had been caught. If she had been 3-4 strides from second when she interfered, then I'm confident that she could not have beat the throw back to first so it would have been an obvious attempt to prevent a double play. Since she was only 3-4 strides from first, not so sure. (I'm assuming short strides since she had come from first and would not be in full stride as if she was running for a base.) Of course, it might be a good "my judgement" call to teach her never to do it again.

IRISHMAFIA Sun Mar 13, 2005 09:24pm

Quote:

Originally posted by emaxos
I think I know how this will go but have to ask anyway.
R1 on first, 0 out.
BR pops up in infield, between 1st and pitcher's circle, infielders converge. R1, three or four strides toward 2nd, joins the chorus yelling, "I got it".
Pitcher, 2nd base get confused and ball drops in. Both runners safe. Fielders admitted afterwards, runner screaming fooled them.
I've seen mention on here rules about intentionally attempting to deceive. Any possibility that the runner's actions were illegal?
Neither runner scored and we won 11-3 so only impact was fielder's looking stupid.


At lower levels this is interference. At the upper levels, it would have to be something to be seen.


emaxos Sun Mar 13, 2005 10:21pm

In my haste to get the question asked, I misstated the situation. There were two out and R1 was running to 2nd. Other factor I failed to add was this was JUCO level. I'm fairly certain NJCAA follows NCAA rules.
Do we still have interference?

Hate to mix topics but are there any restrictions against a runner at 2nd giving pitch location to the batter? I don't believe there is but my DD is now catching and wants the expert's opinion.

bluezebra Sun Mar 13, 2005 11:17pm

"Hate to mix topics but are there any restrictions against a runner at 2nd giving pitch location to the batter? I don't believe there is but my DD is now catching and wants the expert's opinion."

No restriction. But if the defense knows what's happening, the batter get ready to duck on the next pitch.

Bob

rj Mon Mar 14, 2005 11:30am

As an umpire, I would consider this a violation of NFHS 3-6-15c which speaks to behavior in any manner not in accordance with the spirit of fair play. I would, therefore, issue a warning and only eject if the action was repeated.


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