Here's something that happened tonight and I would like your thoughts:

Mens Fastpitch...ASA rules.

First batter bottom of the 5th inning (not that it has any bearing on the play, just setting up the situation). Batter hits a line drive to center field. F8 mis-judges the ball and it gets past him. When he reaches the ball, he picks it up and tosses it over the centerfield fence. When he tossed the ball over the fence, BR was between first and second. What do you do with the runner??

Ball thrown out of play, dead ball, runner awarded two bases from last base achieved at time of throw. Send batter to 3B.

WMB

Yup, send B-R to 3B.

I agree with everyone.

Also, compliment F8 on using the rules to his advantage, even though it's not a very sporting thing to do.

Or maybe compliment the BR on being so intimidating.

But is it the time of the throw as in an overthrow or the time it goes dead as in getting away from a fielder or being intentionally "carried" into dead ball territory.

This would really matter if the batter almost made 2nd and you didn't see it dead until after he reached. ;)

For an intentional throw into DBT, it is the time the ball enters DBT.

I was thinking the same thing as you, Cecil... if the runner was close to 2nd, somehow by the time I looked "quickly" back to check the position of the runners, darn it if she didn't make second! :D

Speaking ASA 8.5.J (Intentionally carrying, kicking, pushing throwing into DBT)

"EFFECT: The ball is dead. Each runner is awarded two bases fro the last base touched at the time the fielder entered or the ball WAS KICKED, PUSHED OR THROWN into dead ball territory."

Not entered.

Now, here is a bit of relief and contradiction for I & J.

EFFECT - Section 5.I-L. The ball is dead and the umpire should award the runners the bases in his judgment they would have reached.

Now we compliment the umpire on knowing and applying the rule that benefits the OFFENDED team the most! NICE! ;)

Rule 8-5G uses the phrase "when the ball left the fielder's hand" - commonly called "time of throw."

Rule 8-5J says "at the time the fielder entered {for a carry} or the ball was kicked {etc.} into dead ball territory."

I have always understood the difference here to be between when the ball left the fielder's hand (8-5G) and when the ball entered DBT (8-5J). "thrown into" means the same thing as "entered because it was thrown." Doesn't it?

The EFFECT you quote is a typo, I suspect. If you look at the 2003 book, the effect only applies to paragraphs L amd M, which were renumbered K and L for 2004. I suspect they meant to say K-L for the effect, not I-L.

Actually, if you check, I believe there are TWO 8.5.G paragraphs in the 2004 book

Quote:

Rule 8-5J says "at the time the fielder entered {for a carry} or the ball was kicked {etc.} into dead ball territory." I have always understood the difference here to be between when the ball left the fielder's hand (8-5G) and when the ball entered DBT (8-5J). "thrown into" means the same thing as "entered because it was thrown." Doesn't it? The EFFECT you quote is a typo, I suspect. If you look at the 2003 book, the effect only applies to paragraphs L amd M, which were renumbered K and L for 2004. I suspect they meant to say K-L for the effect, not I-L.

I have already made a note to offer legislation to make a correction to the rule.

I agree with IrishMafia above, but here goes... just for the fun.

How about "making a travesty of the game"... this oughta get a few fun comments.

Doesn't really apply here, since there is already a rule to cover this situation. So, there really isn't much to make a comment on!