I was working a NCAA game yesterday. Here is what happened. Third inning coach decides to pinch run for the runner at second. He informs the plate umpire about who will replace the runner at second. He tells the girl to go to second. She takes her place on second but then he has second thoughts about putting her there and decides to put a different runner on instead. My question is, since he had reported the first sub to the PU, but the PU had not yet reported this to the other team nor the official scorer,is the first girl that took second base considered a sub and is now done for the game, or is it just like she had never been in the game? Dave

I'll defer to someone who knows any specific NCAA rule on this; but
if it happened to me in a high school game-- I'd let it slide.
We have enough to worry about besides messing with a
player's game eligibility because of a coach's indecision.

NCAA Softball Rule [8-6-a3] Substitute player-Player substitutions: "Substitutes shall be considered officially in the game when reported to the plate umpire."

NFHS - 3-3-3
...when ball is declared live by the umpire.

This rule talks about unreported subs but I assume it also applies to reported subs.

ASA - 4-6-A

...a substitute is not officially in the game until a pitch has been thrown or a play made.

What do you think the opposing coach would say? If I don't think they would care, then I might not care. But officially....

You report her to me, I think she's in the game.

You left off the beginning of this sentence, and the ending. (Although you mention some of it in passing)...

NFHS 3-3-3
Should there be no announcement of substitutions, a substitute has entered the game when the ball is live and:
a. a runner takes the place of a runner she has replaced.

I can't imagine a runner coming onto the field to replace someone without me or my partner noticing and then questioning what is happening. But I don't see this rule as applicable to this situation - the substitute was reported, coach made a second substitution before the ball came live.

NFHS 3-3-4 continues...
A substitute shall not enter the contest unreported (3-6-12 Pen)

I'm not sure how these rulebook changes occur but my book doesn't have a 3-6-12 penalty. So I checked last years NFHS book. Article 4 as quoted above (3-3-4) isn't even in there let alone a germane penalty??? Go figure!

So, I feel she is in as soon as the coach reports her. The line-ups work that way at the beginning of the game. When given to the umpire they become official.

NFHS 4-1-1 Before game time...deliver their respective line-up cards ... to the UIC. ... The substitution regulations are now in effect.

IMHO she's in coach. :)

Yes I agree a pinch runner could never get into one on my games without me noticing. In the original post the coach did report the sub into the game. I was trying to figure
out at what point, according to the rules, is she considered in the game NFHS and ASA) and at what point the coach can change his/her mind and it not be considered a sub. I looked to the two rules I stated as that is all I could find. Do these rules also apply to reported subs?

I think the proper interp of Fed is that the runner must take her place and the ball be made live.

If the coach sends out a CR who is ineligable, do you call her our as soon as she takes her position on the base, or do you say as the coach makes the report, Coach you can't do that? Same with a mistake on the Dp/Flex. It ain't a mistake till you make the ball live, so you can fix it.

That is why we use the line at pre-game, "Coach, report you subs to me and I won't let you make a mistake".

You have got to be conssistant, and follow the rules.

Roger Greene

Dave,
In college ball, that's a substitution. While I'll let the coach do that, I will also "remind" the coach that the first sub was in the game when the coach told me and I verified that change with the coach, so the coach is now burning their second substitution.

High school, and rightly so, does not require or expect as much from their coaches - so we have more leeway. We're often talking about an underpaid and not as knowledgable part-time coach in high school as opposed to a full-time coach in softball. In high school, it's the coach's hobby and in college, it's their full-time job. There's a big difference there.