My 16 yo daughter has expressed a desire to umpire.http://www.click-smilies.de/sammlung...smiley-033.gif

She wants to make a little money, plus even though she decided over the winter to not go out for softball this spring, she is having withdrawal symptoms and wants to stay involved.

I am looking for some advice from anyone who has been a teenage umpire, or anyone who has parented a teenage umpire, especially female teenage umpires, or has any other relavent experience with rookie teenage umpires.

I am thinking I will ask my assignor to partner me with her for her first couple of games. (These will be single umpire games, so she will either be by herself or I will be donating my time - I won't get paid as her partner).

I am thinking I would be the BU, since she needs to primarily get comfortable behind the plate (single ump games).

I am thinking I would only call the first game with her, but sit in the stands and let her go single "man" in the second (league double headers) so she can get some single ump mechanics in before she's purely on her own.

How should I deal with the coaches? Here is what I am thinking.
a) She must be in charge of the plate meeting with me as BU.
b) I'll explain to the coaches that I am there as an umpire trainer (have to explain 2 umps), but I won't tell them she is my daughter (some will probably know, since she's been a travel ball player since 10U...) As part of that, I will explain to the coaches they must talk with her for any issues with her calls; I will not overrule nor will I be their go-between. And, I'll explain that I'll be on the field for the first game only.

Overall, is this plan a good idea or bad idea?

[Edited by Dakota on Feb 23rd, 2004 at 01:33 PM]

When I got started as an umpire, I was about 15 - 17 years old. My dad, then, was an old ex-umpire in the way he had already resigned. In those days I was an umpire in the dutch U10 and U8-competitions (one-man system)
Every game there was an umpire and/or my dad present at the game to watch (over) me. They never interferred during games, but gave (when needed) advise between innings. After each game I was given a sort of rapport, and of course there was a discussion (mostly at home)...
It wasn't always fun, but hee who said it's always nice to be the ump.? After a couple of years, we don't have that much games in a summer/season, I've got to work U16 and senior-games. Always learning.
Since I quit playing my-self, 6 years ago (after knee-problems) I took it up more seriously... I'm 35years old now and counted by the top 25 active umpires in Holland.
Your plan look's fine to me, Dakota. Maybe you have to take more distance, time will tell. Good luck to you and her!
Love,
Alex

My Dad was an ump for 20 years when I became one. They threw me right into Mens fastpitch working with him. I did the bases first game, then plate 2nd game.
I recommend you find pre-season scrimmage games and you umpire it with her right behind you & following you as you move around the field. You cam also tell her what you are thinking about long before the pitch comes.
Do this for one full game, then let her ump the next game, and you follow her around the field telling her what to expect.
On game 3 you are behind the backstop and talking to her in between each play as needed. Do that for about 3-4 games. Then the next time she umps the whole game and you can talk to her while you are in the parking lot afterwards.
Finally..its not you that umps for free..its her !
Every evening when she gets home, she can tell you about her war stories and it will make you closer. It will be great.

Your plan sounds good. I was lucky to be part of 2-ump system when I started out at 18. I usually worked the bases with a "top-notch" umpire working the plate. Important key to my development at that time was a good pregame with the partner, and a good postgame as well. Make sure the pregame with coaches include the emphasis go to the umpire who made the call, to avoid them coming to you on something she called. Good luck and let us know how it goes.

Tom,

Your plan sounds good and solid. Never having worked with you,
but after having read around 2000 posts and answers to various
posts, she will have an excellent opportunity at learning from a
standup umpire. Best of luck to your DD and to you.

I assigned for our local rec league for three years and each year trained two or three girls (including my daughter). It was obvious that after a few games my girl didn't have "what it takes". She was a fine player but a bit too thin skinned to take even the normal hassles involved with umping. A couple of the other girls went on to take good control of game situations and became decent umpires.

I applaud your daughters' interest in giving it a try and I think your ideas about how to break her in are good. The only advice I can give is to give her some distance but be close enough to give a hand if she needs you those first few games. The one thing I bet she'll see right from the start is that umpiring really is kind of hard! She'll make mistakes but if she sticks to it she'll gain a good sense of herself. Good luck.

[Edited by Little Jimmy on Feb 23rd, 2004 at 08:10 PM]

Went through this last summer with 16 yo granddaughter. The biggest problem with turning teenage girls (and guys) loose on a field is that they are going to get bullied by adult coaches. Therefore I felt that field decorum, game management, mechanics, appearance, etc. were very important to give her a professional appearance and level of confidence.

Put the equipment on her and spent several hours on a vacant field with friends and siblings to serve as batter, catcher, and pitcher. Worked on calling from the slot; timing, signals, LOUD voice, hustle, etc. etc.

Appearance is going to be a problem; try getting a teen girl to wear long pants (not jeans) and a belt for the ball bag.

Unfortunately, I did not get on the field with her. Had my own games to cover; but usually could get back for the last inning or two. Typical teenager; did not want coaching (critique, corrections) from behind the fence between innings.

Even though she started out very confident, she could not handle the abuse and hassles from the coaches and she gave it up.

Like your daughter, Tom, she has decided to give up softball this year. Michigan allows HS Juniors to umpire under their "Legacy" program; work with a mentor in sub-varsity games only. I wanted her to do that with me this year and learn how to umpire at a higher level. Plus earn some good money the rest of HS and through college. But she is still a little bitter over last year and won't do it. Maybe next year.

WMB

Based on my experience, I strongly recommend that the adult work with the teen ump to protect them from the coaches. No coach is going to hassle a young ump when I am on the field. But put two teen age girls out there and coaches are going to be on them all the time, telling them the rules (at least their version of the rules); and how to make calls.

It sure sounds like a good plan. I agree with the " putting a little distance ..." When my son started calling at the age of 17, we were fortunate to have 6 good teaching umpires and we always worked a 2 man system. I was very specific when I asked the UIC who to place my son with. I wanted the other 5 to work with him for the first coupla weeks. I never wanted to be on the field until he had about 5-6 weeks of work under his belt. That's not to say I wasn't close to his field, doncha know. They didn't baby him or protect him. He took the heat when he blew the call, or the coaches thought he did, they would just step in when the discussion showed signs of influencing the players, game or my son. He didn't call any ASA, just PONY the first season. By the time the qualifying games were over in the summer, he was one of the most welcome umpires at any of the fields. Even today, he'll comment that calling with the other 5 guys was great and he'd recommend it to anyone. I just stayed in the distance and talked to him in between games, or at home, if he ever got there when I was.
I was just concerned he would want to rely on me too much to cover for him, or I would get a little too thin skinned when the comments were sent his way. Overall, I thought it went well.

I started umpiring, unofficially, at age 12...I used to play little league bseball at 6:00 and then go over to softball and call the 8:00 game for my sister (older, but not by much).

I then called baseball when I was 13, 14, and 15 years old. I used to work solo, because no one else would want to do the game (league never scheduled umpires, just looked for two "dads" out of the stands). I guess a 5'11" 210 pound 14 year old is the same as a dad. I usually only umped my brother's games, which was fun in itself.

When 19 I started doing IHSAA and ASA ball...I didn't really have any training, except past experiences. I "cut my teeth" in ASA on men's A fastpitch...guys who can really bring the ball and make it dance (my first year a guy was clocked at 99mph). I learned by fire...had an older guy who would help "get my head out of my a$$" as he put it (THANKS KEN). Really wished I had someone to help me along when I was younger.

WHile in college, I helped out a youth league in the summer. They had a Junior Umpires Program, where kids (always older than the age group the were working) would call the bases. The first time a kid worked a game, I would meet them and discuss positioning, etc, before the game. Then I would stay near the first base line for conferences between innings IF THEY HAD QUESTIONS. Post game, I'd buy them a hot dog and a Pepsi and discuss the game. We had a great time. They would come out and watch when they weren't working, and I'd talk to them about what happened, where umpire should go, what they should look for, etc. It really worked.

The key was the kids really wanted to be good at what they did...so they asked questions.

In Indiana we actually hold a One-Day Youth Umpire School in conjunction with our ASA Two-Day Umpire School. I've taught the youth school for two years now. I'm amazed at the abilities of the kids, especially the ones who have played the game before. There a several umpires across this country who have worked for 20 years that I wouldn't take to a game...every last one of these kids (including the 11 year old) I'd take to any game, any level. They really want to learn and get better. Plus they have that athleticism thing working for them...which always helps.

As a way of saying it the long way, your plan sounds good. The toughest thing to do in adulthood is be a parent of a teenager...sound like you have a great one...and I agree, reading your posts, you really know this game...a great resource for ANYONE!

Am I the only person on this board who started umpiring as an old fart? (That is, someone over 21).

As many have already mentioned, when you Ump as a teenager you have no experience, thus no confidence. These coaches all of them 20-35 years old know more then you do, and they see you are a "green-bean" and they work you something terrible. Thus you get eaten alive every-single-game.
I was fortunate to have my Dad to watch as I was growing up, so umpiring was not new to me when I started.
I was also thin skinned, and did not have too much tolerance so I was ejecting 6 coaches per year when I first started. They were probably bringing up good points, but yelling at me on the field, beliittleing me in front of a hundred people was not so kosher with me.
Perhaps waiting until you have maturity is not such a bad thing.

Speaking as a current teenage umpire, I see nothing wrong with what you've presented. Let her handle most of the issues because she's gotta learn to be on her own out there and to deal with coaches/parents. I had a mentor my first couple of years and still do. It'll be a good thing for her to know that her mentor will be her dad. Best of luck.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Dakota
My 16 yo daughter has expressed a desire to umpire.http://www.click-smilies.de/sammlung...smiley-033.gif
....
I am thinking I would be the BU, since she needs to primarily get comfortable behind the plate (single ump games).

I am thinking I would only call the first game with her, but sit in the stands and let her go single "man" in the second (league double headers) so she can get some single ump mechanics in before she's purely on her own.

I'd give her the first game on the plate. She'll be trained to work it, excited to work it, and she will not be fatigued. She can rest next game on the bases while she watches and makes mental correction and notes from watching you work. She will only need to be concerned with the ball and the strike zone and you can keep tab on stuff that may happen.
<HR>
How should I deal with the coaches? Here is what I am thinking.
a) She must be in charge of the plate meeting with me as BU.
b) I'll explain to the coaches that I am there as an umpire trainer (have to explain 2 umps), but I won't tell them she is my daughter (some will probably know, since she's been a travel ball player since 10U...) As part of that, I will explain to the coaches they must talk with her for any issues with her calls; I will not overrule nor will I be their go-between. And, I'll explain that I'll be on the field for the first game only.

The coaches do not need to know that this is her first game.
You told her how to run the plate meeting and you will be there for any tough questions. If you need to tell the coaches that you are there in a training capacity,... fine, but I wouldn't touch it. She will know, like any game, if she needs help she can go to her partner.
If you need to explain your presence, or relationship, then most certainly be as generic as necessary (eg, evaluating a newer ump).

Have a ball! :)
mick

Nope, I’m with you there. I started as a coach and came to the boards and made an a$$ of myself as a coach and got put in my place a few times by many of you and then after my daughter went into HS ball and I wasn’t coaching anymore decided to be an Ump at 32. 1 year in and I can say I am glad I made the move and also glad I didn't let you scary guys run me off early :) Although I do believe I was a tad more respectful as a coach on the umpire's boards than a few of the coaches on the other boards which shall remain nameless. But with all that said I believe my times on the boards have definitely made me a better ump and as a newer ump here I can say if I had any advice to give to a new ump, like your daughter, would be lurk here and on the other umpire boards and soak in all you can.

Started when I was 22, but then I am an old fart now. 67 this year.

Glen,
How many fingers have you got to be able to count that high? :)
mick

No, I was way over 21, around double.

Dakota,
Just make sure she knows the basics and I can't imagine she doesn't. I like the idea above about practicing mechanics to help her look experienced. More important, make sure she knows that it doesn't matter if every call is wrong in her first game. After a few, the coaches will give up. :D
A quick prayer is on the way.

Will her handle be "Little Dakota" or IceBlueTwo?

I started working baseball (10-13yo using 75' bases and pro rules) at the age of 14. Other than a few idiot coaches who thought they knew more than anyone just because they were players, I really didn't have any problems through the years.

Thirty-seven years later, still dealing with the idiots who know it all because they are players and a few know-it-all because they watch baseball on TV and have been playing the lowest level of ball available for years.

Personally, I think your daughter should have been wearing a better helmet. Obviously there is some brain damage here. :)

<b> H U H </b>

Tom,

Here is an ugly thought....Suppose her first two teams are
being coached by either Bucket, Atindel, or worse yet Sam.

{Do not mean SamC}

But then it would be nice to see any of them tossed by a
rookie umpire. :D

Thanks for all the encouragement and helpful suggestions, as well as the, ummm, humor!

Mike, I don't think a stronger helmet would have helped - I think it's genetic...

Glen, fortunately the fastpitch coaches around here are pretty laid back. I doubt she'll have any guff from anyone until she gets into her first tournament. Although I would enjoy being on the bases and watching one of those three get tossed by a 16 yo kid!

Skahtboi, I, too, was much older when I umpired my first game - 40!. This will be my fourth year, and I hope to be doing this for quite a few years to come.
I also had a daughter try umpiring for the first time last year, and she says she'll not do that again. She enjoys playing the game too much for right now, and will probably coach after college.
Hubby started umpiring last year at age 44. He had played and coached up until then.

I like the idea of a more experienced umpire being on the field with the teenaged ones. I had a similar situation in a girls fastptich league a couple summers ago where I was the home plate, and my assignor's stepdaughter worked the bases. Coach didn't like a call she made so he went barrelling out at her and she had the deer in the headlights look. I jogged over, hoping the coach saw me out the corner of his eye. He did and hightailed it back to the coach's box. I then asked him what was the matter and he said never mind. Later, my assignor said that the coach admitted he didn't want to be toe to toe with a guy who looks like he was a linebacker in high school or something.

Well, I guess I'm part of the Senior class as far as starting goes. I was 41 when I gave up coaching and started calling. I've never looked back. It has been a blast. Been calling 8 years now and I look forward to every game, now matter age or level of ability. Dakota, I hope your daughter enjoys it as much as the rest of us do.

As I mentioned earlier, I "cut my softball teeth" with Men's Fastpitch. We had a young lady who would come umpire with me about once a week. She was an excellent player of the game (D-I quality) and a very good umpire. These guys used to think they could intimidate her, to the point of actually getting in her face (she was only 5'1" and weight about 100 pounds soaking wet). I guess they thought that since she was a female they could intimidate her. She never let them get to her though. She would calmly ask them to back away, and they eventually got the point. To be honest, she's much better at umpiring than I am, but I had half the problems. I guess being 6'2" and tipping the scale at nearly 300 pounds they never really wanted to mess with me (although I'm as quiet as a mouse...really!) Why is that?

I have actually worked a game where Sam was the coach. I had no trouble at all with him and there were some times in the game where he could have made a stink if he wanted to.

He is just stuck on the strike zone thing and is stubborn about it. But he's actually a nice guy.

First time umpiring
 

Hey guys, long time no see. Plus I'm jumping on an old thread. Anyways, when I started umping almost 4 years ago, i was but a youngin' only 14. I've only really worked 10s and 12s around here because of my conflicting schedule with games and such. But last year I worked my first 16s game, plate even and I got a lot of compliments on it. But when I started first game was bases and second was plate. My dad was an ump but he really didn't help me too much and the umpires I generally worked with didn't really either. Don't take this the wrong way, but sometimes it appeared I had the more knowledge on the field. Recently I've worked with a girl who's about 4 years older than me and we work pretty good together. We each have over 10 years of ball experience so most people here in podunk Nebraska don't get too hostile with things. Granted I haven't worked too many high strung games, I think I've been allowed to grow as an umpire just by going out there and doing it. For me persoanlly I get better as I go because I gain confidence in myself. But thats just me.

lildani, what part of Nebraska are you from? Must be somewhere in the boondocks because I haven't had fans/players/coaches like that since I moved to the big O.

FUBLUE, I think size scares people. I've had coaches bigger than I am who are never afraid to approach me and discuss something, while coaches who are "smaller" than I are always coming out screaming and hollering, hoping to gain the advantage. Must be a Billy Martin thing.

I think you're right, but I don't try to use it. Once a coach knows me (as most coaches in this area do) they realize I'm a really mild-mannered guy. I know I'm large, but I don't use it against people.

It also goes both ways. Some coaches see me and say, "this guy is big, so he must be slow and bad." either that, or they think I enjoy being yelled at. I work my butt off on the diamond (as anyone who has ever worked with me will testify to) and hustle on every play. But it takes a while for a coach to learn that just because I'm big doesn't mean I'm slow, or bad, or I'm going to let him yell at me like I'm a farm animal or something.

i'm from up around fremont area. little north of that. well, i mean I've had my share of coaches who question the calls but I have never had the ones who charge out hootin' and hollerin'.

Two things: lildani, consider yourself lucky. These people here in the big O are so serious about the game, Bobby Knight looks like a schoolgirl. Maybe we'll bump into each other at a tournament.

FUBLUE-you said it! AMEN!