USA change 3 - JO lineups

[CecilOne]

Rule 7, Section 2F: Junior Olympic Fast Pitch Pool Play: Nine defensive players will bat or teams have the following options:
1. Bat nine players without the DP/Flex.
2. Bat nine Players and use the DP/Flex.
3. Bat up to and including all roster players without a DP/Flex.
4. Bat up to and including all roster players with the DP/Flex.

Rules referenced below are affected by this change for JO Pool Play Only.
Rule 1, Extra Player (EP) Definition;
Rule 4 Section 1C, Added New [C];
Rule 4 Section 1D [2A] Exception;
Rule 4 Section, 3B;
Rule 4 Section 4, Added G;
Rule 4 Section 6D, Adds an exception for JO Pool Play only;
Rule 8 Section 10C, Adds an exception for JO Pool Play only;

Effects of this rule are as follows:
• Players not listed in a defensive position will be listed as an EP;
• EPs will be listed beginning in the 10th spot of the batting order;
• When not using the DP/FLEX any 9 can play defense;
• When using the DP/FLEX any 8 and the FLEX can play defense;
• The Batting order will always remain fixed;
• Any Player may be used as a courtesy runner for the pitcher or catcher;
• Any Player can be used as a pinch runner for an injured player;
• If a player is on base when it is their time to bat;
 They will be removed from the base and take their turn at bat.
 The person who they are running for will be called out.
• When only batting nine defensive players or using the DP/FLEX;
 If an injured player is not able to bat an out will be recorded for their turn at bat unless the team has a substitute not already in the batting order that can take their place.
• When batting more than nine defensive players and have no available substitutes;
 If an injured player is not able to bat in their place in the batting order, the batting order will be compressed to the number of batters in the batting order less the injured player with no out recorded for the injured player unable to bat.


Comment: This requirement now allows you to either bat 9 players or bat up to every roster player present. Any player can be a pinch runner or a courtesy runner. Any player on base, running for someone else is removed to take their turn at bat, an out recorded for who they are running. If an injured player is unable to take their turn to at bat the batting order will be compressed with no out recorded for the injured player unable to bat.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Why bother with a line up at all?

[Dakota]

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

Why bother with a line up at all?

The only part of it that is materially different from what we have been doing for 15+ years in local tournaments is the "anyone" can be a courtesy or pinch runner. It's "last out" here. This will be interesting.

If USA was going to allow "bat the roster" for pool play, this is much improved over the half step they took previously, IMO.

[Andy]

Cecil....May I inquire as to where you are getting the information that these are the approved changes?

[Big Slick]

Originally Posted by Andy

Cecil....May I inquire as to where you are getting the information that these are the approved changes?

I got the same changes. This is legit.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by Andy

Cecil....May I inquire as to where you are getting the information that these are the approved changes?

I suspect from UIC

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by Dakota

The only part of it that is materially different from what we have been doing for 15+ years in local tournaments is the "anyone" can be a courtesy or pinch runner. It's "last out" here. This will be interesting.

If USA was going to allow "bat the roster" for pool play, this is much improved over the half step they took previously, IMO.

I'm just not a big fan of rules for the purpose of inclusivity (if that is a real word ) for championship play.

[Andy]

Originally Posted by Big Slick

I got the same changes. This is legit.

I have no doubt they are legit...I just haven't seen anything published from USA SB yet regarding the approved rule/code changes.

[Big Slick]

Originally Posted by Andy

I have no doubt they are legit...I just haven't seen anything published from USA SB yet regarding the approved rule/code changes.

Maybe your region is slacking. Region 1 is where it's at (and all the cool kids -- well "cold" kids because it was 15 freakin' degree last week).

[Dakota]

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

I'm just not a big fan of rules for the purpose of inclusivity (if that is a real word ) for championship play.

I get your point.

But USA needs to compete in the "marketplace" for teams.

If some teams want to take a more "casual", "friendly", or "show case" approach to pool play (i.e. play for seeding), it doesn't really hurt anything once the championship brackets begin (except perhaps their own team's seeding).

[CecilOne]

Originally Posted by CecilOne

• When only batting nine defensive players or using the DP/FLEX;
 If an injured player is not able to bat an out will be recorded for their turn at bat unless the team has a substitute not already in the batting order that can take their place.

• When batting more than nine defensive players and have no available substitutes;
 If an injured player is not able to bat in their place in the batting order, the batting order will be compressed to the number of batters in the batting order less the injured player with no out recorded for the injured player unable to bat.

This is the part which will confuse coaches and probably a lot of umpires, especially the difference.

[Manny A]

Originally Posted by CecilOne

Rule 7, Section 2F: Junior Olympic Fast Pitch Pool Play: Nine defensive players will bat or teams have the following options:
.
.
.
4. Bat up to and including all roster players with the DP/Flex.

So if a team bats everyone of its players, how does the DP/Flex even come into play?

Oh wait, I get it. A team has 15 players on the roster. They can bat 14 of those players, and the 15th is a Flex who can only bat in the DP's batting slot. But imagine how pissed daddy is going to be if his DD is the Flex, and sees everyone hitting except for her.

[CecilOne]

Originally Posted by Manny A

So if a team bats everyone of its players, how does the DP/Flex even come into play?

Oh wait, I get it. A team has 15 players on the roster. They can bat 14 of those players, and the 15th is a Flex who can only bat in the DP's batting slot. But imagine how pissed daddy is going to be if his DD is the Flex, and sees everyone hitting except for her.

Same as any other FLEX and gets more playing time than most batters.

[AtlUmpSteve]

Originally Posted by Manny A

So if a team bats everyone of its players, how does the DP/Flex even come into play?

Oh wait, I get it. A team has 15 players on the roster. They can bat 14 of those players, and the 15th is a Flex who can only bat in the DP's batting slot. But imagine how pissed daddy is going to be if his DD is the Flex, and sees everyone hitting except for her.

She's a princess pitcher, Manny, and no one wants to risk her breaking a finger (or nail) trying to bat in a meaningless game. Daddy will be the first to agree.

[teebob21]

Originally Posted by AtlUmpSteve

She's a princess pitcher, Manny, and no one wants to risk her breaking a finger (or nail) trying to bat in a meaningless game. Daddy will be the first to agree.

Jeebus, this is so true. How many times have we heard "She throws eight pitches! I know she's 13, but did you know she'll have a full ride to Oklahoma?" (Five of which are fastballs of various speeds and locations, a "rise ball" which is just a consistently high pitch, one breaking pitch, and a sometimes-decent changeup.)

I am no coach, but the best pitchers I have ever seen have had the following: a fastball with command (fast, but actual speed mostly irrelevant), a changeup that hits the zone 60%+ of the time, and a true breaking pitch; bonus points if it's a drop ball or screwball (breaking away from righties and inside on lefties). If you can throw these three with control, then yes, you'll be in line for some school money somewhere.

Molly Hill was the best youth/club/HS pitcher I have ever seen. I worked a state tournament game where she threw a perfect game with 21 strikeouts. It was an absolute joy to be behind the plate. Easiest "big" game I ever had.