on-ice officials goof-up??

[chseagle]

Players H1 & V4 get into scrappy play at the blue line of the attacking zone of H. Both get penalty calls against them (H1 for holding, V4 for roughing). Both happened at the same time, but the R calls them as separate penalties. Team official comes to Timekeeper's Bench & complains about the call to the scorekeeper that they should have been coincidental pentalties. What's the call?

[RefWEB]

Originally Posted by chseagle

Players H1 & V4 get into scrappy play at the blue line of the attacking zone of H. Both get penalty calls against them (H1 for holding, V4 for roughing). Both happened at the same time, but the R calls them as separate penalties. Team official comes to Timekeeper's Bench & complains about the call to the scorekeeper that they should have been coincidental pentalties. What's the call?

What's the rule set you're using? In some, they're coincidental, and you're 5 on 5. In some, if just a minor aside, then both teams play one short and its 4 on 4.

Cant tell you if they kicked a rule until I know what rules they're calling

Either way, if bench staff starts complaining to the timekeeper about ANYTHING...they ain't going to be on the bench for very long in my games...

[chseagle]

Originally Posted by RefWEB

What's the rule set you're using? In some, they're coincidental, and you're 5 on 5. In some, if just a minor aside, then both teams play one short and its 4 on 4.

Cant tell you if they kicked a rule until I know what rules they're calling

Either way, if bench staff starts complaining to the timekeeper about ANYTHING...they ain't going to be on the bench for very long in my games...

The rule set is USA Hockey Junior.

The team official complaining is a member of the team management/administration (office staff), not bench personnel.

The R calls it as a 4-on-4, as if the two penalties are separate incidents away from one another 1-2 seconds apart, though happening at the same time.

According to page 45 of the 2013-2017 USA Hockey Junior Rulebook (rule 402: Minor Penalties):

"When an equal number of minor penalties (coincidental) are assessed to players from both teams, the penalized players shall take their place on the penalty bench and immediate substitution will take place for an equal number of minor penalties. The penalized players shall not leave the penalty bench until the first stoppage of play following the expiration of their penalties. Additional minor penalties assessed at the same stoppage that are not considered coincidental minor penalties shall be served in the normal manner.

Coincidental minor penalties shall not be taken into account for the purpose of a delayed penalty under Rule 408 (Delayed Penalties)."

[RefWEB]

As an aside, I don't care who complains to the tk...somebody is getting the heave. Not to minimize their role, but they have NO POWER to change anything in this situation. If somebody thinks a rule is kicked, then have the guts to complain to the guy in charge of the rules...the referee.

That being said, if that the rule, then yes..the referee booted it. Coincidental penalties don't have to be as a result if the exact same incident. As long as they're assessed at the dame stoppage, they're coincidental and it's 5 on 5.

[chseagle]

Originally Posted by RefWEB

As an aside, I don't care who complains to the tk...somebody is getting the heave. Not to minimize their role, but they have NO POWER to change anything in this situation. If somebody thinks a rule is kicked, then have the guts to complain to the guy in charge of the rules...the referee.

That being said, if that the rule, then yes..the referee booted it. Coincidental penalties don't have to be as a result if the exact same incident. As long as they're assessed at the dame stoppage, they're coincidental and it's 5 on 5.

Nothing got changed, except for the fact they played 4-on-4, instead of 5-on-5. During next intermission, the on-ice officials were asked about the blarge & the mistake was realized.

The incident happened during the 1st game of the season, so it was a learning experience.

[RefWEB]

Originally Posted by chseagle

Nothing got changed, except for the fact they played 4-on-4, instead of 5-on-5. During next intermission, the on-ice officials were asked about the blarge & the mistake was realized.

The incident happened during the 1st game of the season, so it was a learning experience.

No offence, but referees shouldn't be "learning" about coincidental penalties during a Junior game!

[chseagle]

Originally Posted by RefWEB

No offence, but referees shouldn't be "learning" about coincidental penalties during a Junior game!

Very true, especially since the on-ice officials were not rookies.