position switch

[c it first]

Situation is NFHS Varsity : Team coach is not happy with wing official's spots or calls. Coach complains to WH and BJ at timeouts and every other opportunity . During the halftime break - BJ , U , and WH agree it would be a good idea to defuse the situation and relax the coach by making a position switch. L & U switch for the 2nd half. Good idea ? Bad idea ? No big deal either way ?

[Patsfan2431]

In my opinion i think its a bad idea. If it was in the opinion of the WH that the wing was doign something wrong, the WH should correct it at halftime or during a timeout. By replacing the positions of officials, it shows the by the coach complaining, he can in a way, modify the result of an official's call. I understand the WH didn't reverse a call on the field, but by changing to position of a crew member, it will only cause more problems for that crew. The wing official that moved to U will prob. be down on himself and may make a mistake. Also, by changing the position of a potential "bad" official, the official will still make the "bad" calls, but now only at a different position. I believe the situation should have been taken care of internally and not during a game esp. a Varsity one.

[Ed Hickland]

So you do a pregame and everyone supposedly understands his position. Coach complains about officials calls or whatever. Now you take two officials and put them out of position simply because the coach complains. Not because of an injury. But because the coach complains.

Coaches complain all the time. Sometimes they have their reasons, most of the time they don't.

So, do you give in to the coach because now he owns you.

[JugglingReferee]

If I'm the WH and a coach is complaining to the sides guys, I will speak to him. After that, the side guys have my blessing to flag as they see fit.

[Snake~eyes]

If I was WH I would first tell the coach to be quiet. Then I would talk to my wing guy about it during timeouts and what not.

Coaches always complain about somthing, that's like if a coach starts yelling theres holding you throw a flag, not because you didn't see it.

[c it first]

Thanks for the replys. Some background : I did a few varsity games ( wing) ; several jr. varsity (wing, umpire ); lots of Freshman & knee hi ( all positions) ; This was my first time with this crew.
The Home team was using students on the chains. The students worked the chains for each home game since August. I interviewed them and although I was not in agreement with their age and working chains at this level, they convinced me they did in fact do this several times this year. Our BJ measured the chain with them without comment. On the third play of the game the visiting coach asks for a conference with the WH. The students were replaced with Adults. No big deal until.... home team sweeps and runnner goes OOB near the line to gain. I have the spot and feel this is a first down . The WH was trailing the play and I say lets measure right here. I look backward and see the chain post is moving toward me. oh no. Also the clip has been removed!!! WH gives first down.
Later the visiting team is 4th and 4 at home team's 25. There is a pick up of about 4. The runner tossed the ball forward after he stopped. I had my spot and while waiting for someone to get me the ball I looked back to make sure the chains were not moving. Measurement indicates line to gain not met and the visitiong coach goes off on me about the terrible spot. I told him I had to correct spot. He came in front of me and began to accuse me of cheating. " you looked back saw the LTG and spotted the ball against me" he said. I didn't want to flag at this point so I informed him #1 - get out of my face - #2 you are out of the box. The flag is almost out and he retreats.
He now has a complaint about everything.The coach has a longtime reputation for getting on the wings.The crew informed me of this prior to the game.
Although I am relatively new at officiating, I am old enough not to be intimidated by a coach. Apparently the crew thought otherwise and decided to replace me. I was told it was not anything I had done but rather they didn't want the coach complaining to ?? someone !!! It's the first time I left the field not feeling that I really had fun out there. It's a strange feeling.
sorry for the long post, I just needed to get this out.

[c it first]

told him I had to correct spot.

Should read - told him I had the correct spot.

[ABoselli]

"You're cheating" equals flag to me. You can assail my calls, judgement, vacant expression etc, but don't call me anything or accuse me of cheating.

Word to the wise - never turn around and look away from the field as an HL, especially when you think you might be close tp a 1st. Let the LJ do his job and inform the R that you're close and he can look and stop it if need be. I've had to learn the hard way, but life's best lessons are often it's hardest.

As an R, I've had times when I'd like to switch guys around, but, at the end of the day, I've got to believe in them (as much as it pains me sometimes) to do their job.

My first varsity game ever was probably my worst ever - I had the coaches, players and fans all on me hard for the entire second half. I came away really doubting myself after that. I got absolutely no help from my R. After having time to reflect on it, it was probably the best thing that ever happened to me - I had walked through the fire and come out the other side - and had gotten it out of the way early. I was a better official for it. Now, when things get a little dicey, I can always think back to that game and whatever is going wrong seems small compared to the clubbing I took that day.

[Patsfan2431]

C-
I want to share with you a the same feeling i had that you expressed. I did a pop warner playoff game this weekend. It was my first game of playoff caliber and it was two teams that are competing to basically win the state and go to regions and then on to FL. for the championship. I was running the chains like you and as soon as the game started, i was getting grief. Every run play to my side there was a hold and every pass play was DPI (so the coach told me). I couldn't even throw a flg in his favor without him saying that my flag was late. There was a close call to the sidelines where the runner was tackled as he went out of bounds. I didn't call a PF because it wasnt. My WH agreed with me and the grief and the name calling from the stands was unbelievable. I really have not been verbally abused in all my life. If i was able to really sort out the fans who had been yelling, half the stands would have been ejected. Then near the end of the game, the coach on my sidelining losing and facing the fact that his season was over, starts screaming that a off lineman wasnt of the LOS. I explained to him the rule and he didn;t care. Netx play a run to my side and two of his def players run the ball carrier out of bounds. But a third player tackles him while approx 5 yeards OOB. I throw the flag and the place erupts. I mean coaches were holding back fans from coming onto the field. My point is this, though my calls were right, the feeling of dissapointment was still there. I wasn't having fun and getting abused like that sucked. But as the week came and went, it was the best thing to go through. My calls were good, my next few games were not affected and the good congratulated me for having the courage to throw the PF flag at that time on that sideline. Dont let it affect you in a negative way, learn from it, and let your calls be the factor in your personal feelings, not the feelings of others.

[JMN]

Good posts that remind us all why we're out there in the first place...to make sure sportmanship and the integrity of the game is upheld for the players.

Ours is not to wish that at the end of a game that all of the players, coaches, and fans agree with our calls and spots. If that's what you expect, now's the time to do something else.

And, all of us have worked a sideline with a coach that decided that it was his God-given right to work you all night long. If we had the choice, we would have opted for a root canal or something as pleasant.

However, these are great learning experiences and make us better officials. The amount you learn through adversity should not be discounted.

My advice is to remain as calm as possible (easy to say), focus on the game, and use these as learning situations to learn how to better manage coaches and sidelines. The folks who post on this board can provide a number of techniques to help us all better manage our sidelines.

[Cain]

I'd maybe report this to my supervisor. The WH has no right to "re-assign" you, ...as much as you have to "re-asign" him.

This is a HORRIBLE decision by the WH.

If a coach gets in front of you while you are facing the field, ....you flag it. He calls you a cheater, ...you flag it. He gets another one, and he's gone. He'll be reported and the state commish will have a discussion with him and his school about his job going forward around here.

If they start yelling all the time about everything I do. I quit speaking with them. Alot of this is preventative officiating, ...try not to let it get to this. Don't let it get out of hand. We've all had these type coaches, ...but there is no unwritten rule that says you have to put up with this.

It maybe because you are newer, and by your actions things just come across less confident. Not much you can do about it. They can tell when they have a experienced/good official on their side.

Just don't allow it to get to this. Set the tone early.



[Edited by Cain on Oct 28th, 2003 at 03:25 AM]

[c it first]

A few things learned.
1.) I am not as good as I think I am nor as bad as I felt after the last game. ( I saw the film )
2.) Very good officials had bad games at one time or another
3.) I should have protested at the position switch. I didn't agree yet I submitted to the suggestion.
4.) I am going to stick around. I put lots of time into this. January - August included.

.

[Cain]

Some helpful things I was taught coming up:

1. Make a booklet to review before all your games. I keep things like rule changes for the year, memos, highlighted mechanics and keys, ....also some reviews I have during my previous games from our observers. Look over it before you go to your game. jeff Rice taught me this. he worked the Super Bowl year before last. Also, I try to write down on a sheet after the game, things I missed or need to lookup. Do it right away so you don't forget, while it's still fresh.

2. If you can, write the AD of the home school AFTER your game and request a game tape. I watch myself alot. Not so much on the calls missed/made - -although sometimes I do, ...but my movement and mechanics. You'll be amazed at the things you didn't realize you are doing.

3. NEVER talk about other officials behind their backs. It always gets back to them. You're just going to have to learn you're going to work with bad officials sometimes.

4. Stay loyal to your fellow officials as well, and to your supervisor. You're a team out there with your fellow officials as well. Don't turn to the coach and say thing slike "yea, I wouldn't have called it", etc.

5. Dress the part. Pressed shirt, nice crisp hat, up to date uniform, clean white pants ...hustle - - "but hustle slow". Big Ten supervisor told me these things. Sometimes by looking the part you can fool them. You send a big message in your presentation. Fill out all the details. be thorough, ...but don't officiate too technically.

6. And I big thing I hate, ...NEVER get an ego. Be willing to take advice from anyone else. I hate this from other officials. Be "coachable". always be willing to admit to yourself you can improve, ...no matter how good you get.



It takes time. Be patient. I learn every game.

[AlabamaBlue]

Originally posted by Cain
2. If you can, write the AD of the home school AFTER your game and request a game tape. I watch myself alot. Not so much on the calls missed/made - -although sometimes I do, ...but my movement and mechanics. You'll be amazed at the things you didn't realize you are doing.

You may even go as far as to buy a blank tape and shipping box self-addressed with correct postage. Give that to the home coach before the game and 99% of the time you'll get a game tape, usualy with a list of things you missed

[ABoselli]

Those HS video guys always seem to point the camera at the players, though!