National Federation New Kickoff Mechanics

[IAUMP]

Originally Posted by Forksref

bcl has it right.

I am wondering why the Fed thinks the L has to be so far forward. Having 2 guys on the 50 in a 5-man crew doesn't seem to make sense.

Actually it does, when you take into consideration the new rule on when K can legally block R. Since K can not initate contact with R until the ball has gone beyond R's restraining line, or K has a legal right to recover the kick. It would be too difficult for one official, to determine if/when the ball crossed the restraining line and when/if K initiated contact with R. I am the U in my crew and we have discussed if the ball comes my direction, I have the ball and the L has the blocks. It would be reversed if the ball goes to the L side of the field.

[waltjp]

Originally Posted by IAUMP

Actually it does, when you take into consideration the new rule on when K can legally block R. Since K can not initate contact with R until the ball has gone beyond R's restraining line, or K has a legal right to recover the kick. It would be too difficult for one official, to determine if/when the ball crossed the restraining line and when/if K initiated contact with R. I am the U in my crew and we have discussed if the ball comes my direction, I have the ball and the L has the blocks. It would be reversed if the ball goes to the L side of the field.

And there's the rub. How many unexpected on-sides kicks do you see in a year? I can remember entire seasons without seeing an attempted on-sides kick, let alone one that was unexpected. And when we expect it we put 2 guys on each restraining line.

I don't see the reasoning behind putting 2 officials on R's line in a 5-man game for something we'll be lucky to see once a season.

[mbyron]

Originally Posted by waltjp

I don't see the reasoning behind putting 2 officials on R's line in a 5-man game for something we'll be lucky to see once a season.

Agree. Ohio doesn't use this mechanic.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by waltjp

And there's the rub. How many unexpected on-sides kicks do you see in a year? I can remember entire seasons without seeing an attempted on-sides kick, let alone one that was unexpected. And when we expect it we put 2 guys on each restraining line.

I don't see the reasoning behind putting 2 officials on R's line in a 5-man game for something we'll be lucky to see once a season.

As a BJ I have clearly seen onside kicks, but not where we are surprised in any way.

I think coverage down field is more important. Then again maybe this will show some that 5 man crews are going to be flawed in our current game with the focus on safety and passing. I can only wish.

Peace

[ODJ]

At present, Illinois will only have the LJ and U switch positions. HL stays at the 30.

Reasoning for the LJ-U switch (as explained by NF and IHSA) is the LJ has more experience with forward progress during the game and is thus more accurate. To this I do not agree.

[bcl1127]

Originally Posted by ODJ

At present, Illinois will only have the LJ and U switch positions. HL stays at the 30.

Reasoning for the LJ-U switch (as explained by NF and IHSA) is the LJ has more experience with forward progress during the game and is thus more accurate. To this I do not agree.

I am glad I will get to stay at the 30 and keep the coverage as it was. But moving the U seems odd. Cannot wait to see some of the U's chasing after a long return down their sideline...

[bisonlj]

Originally Posted by bcl1127

I am glad I will get to stay at the 30 and keep the coverage as it was. But moving the U seems odd. Cannot wait to see some of the U's chasing after a long return down their sideline...

If you are doing it right the U should have a shorter run. The deep official should have forward progress to the K2 and the K/R official would work like a deep wing and get to the goal line on a break away. Using that mechanic the U should have gone from the R20 (or deeper as many do) to the K2 (78 yards). Now they only have to go from the 50 to the goal line (50 yards). If you did some handoff of the runner around mid-field then you weren't using a solid mechanic.

I think it makes complete sense for the L to work deep since it is most like his normal position on running plays. I always thought it was odd that as a U I normally worked in the middle but on free kicks I was now on the sideline and had to rule on forward progress.

[bcl1127]

Originally Posted by bisonlj

If you are doing it right the U should have a shorter run. The deep official should have forward progress to the K2 and the K/R official would work like a deep wing and get to the goal line on a break away. Using that mechanic the U should have gone from the R20 (or deeper as many do) to the K2 (78 yards). Now they only have to go from the 50 to the goal line (50 yards). If you did some handoff of the runner around mid-field then you weren't using a solid mechanic.

Well, our state has told us, and the official 5-man mechanics guide on our states website has the runners "handed off" to the BJ and in the old mechanic the LJ and the U and L clean up behind the play. So I am just going by what is done in our state and what I was taught from day one about kickoffs. If you don't think it is solid (personally I do and I guess our state does as well) I guess that is your opinion, but I was going by what we are taught.

[hawktalk]

Fed's covert attempt to move to smaller, quicker, more agile umpires?

[Forksref]

My game last Friday gave me a good number of looks at this new mechanic. (9 kickoffs)

The new rule prohibits blocking by K until the ball goes 10 yds. My decades of experience tells me that this hasn’t occurred and the new mechanic is trying to protect against something that doesn’t happen. If it didn’t happen when it was legal then why expect it to happen when it is not legal now? The problem is that the L is now 50 yds away from the R who must stay at the GL. In our game Friday we had trouble getting accurate spots on returns on the chain side because the L was so far away at the kick. As R, I have to trail the play and not get even with the runner. This is not a good mechanic and Minnesota has now told its officials NOT to use the mechanic. I agree.

If there is an obvious on-side kick situation, then we have 4 guys on those 2 lines anyway.

[BigBaldGuy]

I stopped questioning a long time ago why the NFHS does things...just roll with the punches. My job is to follow their rules and mechanics.

[Forksref]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

As a BJ I have clearly seen onside kicks, but not where we are surprised in any way.

I think coverage down field is more important. Then again maybe this will show some that 5 man crews are going to be flawed in our current game with the focus on safety and passing. I can only wish.

Peace

I agree 100%. No need for all the attention at the R line. I've never seen the attempted blocking by the K team and certainly don't expect any now with the new restriction. We'll talk about this in our local association as we normally don't get much direction from our state association.

[jchamp]

Originally Posted by waltjp

And there's the rub. How many unexpected on-sides kicks do you see in a year? I can remember entire seasons without seeing an attempted on-sides kick, let alone one that was unexpected. And when we expect it we put 2 guys on each restraining line.

I don't see the reasoning behind putting 2 officials on R's line in a 5-man game for something we'll be lucky to see once a season.

It seems that it would be best for the WH to have this alignment as an option for the "expected" onside kick. Some schools (like Arkansas' Pulaski Academy) EXCLUSIVELY use the onside kick. Pulaski Academy Onside Kicks vs Cabot - Sept 9, 2011 - YouTube <-- These are all from one game, and PA was up 29-0 before their opponent made its first snap from scrimmage.

But discretion should be available to the WH who will be aware of the coaching styles, and can make an intelligent assessment of the game situation and what he needs to do. There is no need for a one-size-fits-all kickoff procedure.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by jchamp

It seems that it would be best for the WH to have this alignment as an option for the "expected" onside kick. Some schools (like Arkansas' Pulaski Academy) EXCLUSIVELY use the onside kick. Pulaski Academy Onside Kicks vs Cabot - Sept 9, 2011 - YouTube <-- These are all from one game, and PA was up 29-0 before their opponent made its first snap from scrimmage.

But discretion should be available to the WH who will be aware of the coaching styles, and can make an intelligent assessment of the game situation and what he needs to do. There is no need for a one-size-fits-all kickoff procedure.

I actually thought that the reverse would happen -- that they'd move more officials back to the goal line so that all officials could work forward. Put the R, U, and L across the goal line and then adjust forward if kicks were short.

But we just do as we're told. This is the new mechanic and we'll be using it. And I'll have to cover more of the field.

BTW, the R in this mechanic is to start on the numbers (or 9-yard-mark) on the chain side -- not the sideline.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by RichMSN

BTW, the R in this mechanic is to start on the numbers (or 9-yard-mark) on the chain side -- not the sideline.

Our state's mechanic wanted the R to start more on the sideline and adjust the LJ (used to be U) on the GL if ability of kicker or wind dictated that movement.

Peace