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Robert Goodman Fri Oct 28, 2011 11:28pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by jchamp (Post 796335)
I think that's pretty clear. It's possible they got permission, and no one outside of that particular discussion would need to know.
Otherwise, it's still a copyrighted work. If the NFHS sends a DMCA takedown notice to the web-hosting company or ISP, and that company doesn't at least pass the word on, then there is serious litigation possibility at stake. At the end of the day, it's best to not screw with it unless you've got the documentation that proves you were given permission.
There is certainly a legitimate point that the rules may be public domain, but there's lots in there besides rules.

I've got a friend who's an intellectual property lawyer, plus another who's done some IP cases, and I'd love to make a case of it. If BestWeb's too chicken, I'd set up a server, but the bandwidth would be crazy low. Meanwhile if you want a copy of the PDF, I'll e-mail it.

I've got some other work on my site that should have priority, but gotta remember to put this in line for stuff to put up.

ump33 Sat Oct 29, 2011 08:57am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Welpe (Post 796340)
Tony, I wonder if officials in NC have some sort of special access through your state.

If NC does, I wish someone would share with me ...

jchamp Sun Oct 30, 2011 12:21am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robert Goodman (Post 796380)
I've got a friend who's an intellectual property lawyer, plus another who's done some IP cases, and I'd love to make a case of it. If BestWeb's too chicken, I'd set up a server, but the bandwidth would be crazy low. Meanwhile if you want a copy of the PDF, I'll e-mail it.

I've got some other work on my site that should have priority, but gotta remember to put this in line for stuff to put up.

I spoke with one of my partners who is more senior in my association. Permission to post this pdf file was obtained from NFHS prior to it being posted.

So to answer the OP, they followed the rules and used the mechanisms available. Yes, what you see is permissible because that exception in the copyright notice about requiring permission to duplicate the file was followed. Your association may be able to do something similar.

bigjohn Sun Oct 30, 2011 06:28am

Well, there you go! Asked and answered!
Thanks, JCChamps

bigjohn Tue Nov 01, 2011 07:48am

It appears they have pulled the rules and case books!

Rules & Resources

JugglingReferee Tue Nov 01, 2011 09:03am

Quote:

Originally Posted by JugglingReferee (Post 795971)
Probably not, so download while you can. :eek:

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigjohn (Post 796786)
It appears they have pulled the rules and case books!

Rules & Resources

Told ya!

BktBallRef Tue Nov 01, 2011 10:45am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Welpe (Post 796340)
Tony, I wonder if officials in NC have some sort of special access through your state.

No. I signed up via the NFHS website, paid my $35, and had access.

BktBallRef Tue Nov 01, 2011 10:56am

Quote:

Originally Posted by jchamp (Post 796461)
I spoke with one of my partners who is more senior in my association. Permission to post this pdf file was obtained from NFHS prior to it being posted.

I doubt that very much. And the fact that it's now been removed would pretty much prove that point.

I was the moderator on the NFHS discussion forum for several years. One thing I was told was they do not allow their rules publications to be published online by ANYONE, even state or local associations. In fact, this is the last year the NFHS will even publish pdf rule publications on their own website because of other sites downloading the publications and posting on their own site.

To my knowledge, every instance of any rule publication that has ever published online has been taken down when it came to the attention of the NFHS.

HLin NC Tue Nov 01, 2011 11:44am

Just received an e-mail that the NFHS and Arbiter have just released the NFHS Basketball rules and case app for 2011-12 on the Android Market. iPhone & iPad to be released "soon". Other NFHS rules apps "will be coming later this year and into 2012".

Ia-Ref Tue Nov 01, 2011 12:39pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by BktBallRef (Post 796811)
I doubt that very much. And the fact that it's now been removed would pretty much prove that point.

I was the moderator on the NFHS discussion forum for several years. One thing I was told was they do not allow their rules publications to be published online by ANYONE, even state or local associations. In fact, this is the last year the NFHS will even publish pdf rule publications on their own website because of other sites downloading the publications and posting on their own site.

To my knowledge, every instance of any rule publication that has ever published online has been taken down when it came to the attention of the NFHS.

That's intersting because when the new NFHS/Arbiter started up, I was able to get the Rules & Casebook online at their site.
By the traffic on the new site, I would have to say that at least for now the change has been a "bust". Especially because some of the old discussions will never be seen again.:(

jchamp Tue Nov 01, 2011 03:59pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by BktBallRef (Post 796811)
I doubt that very much. And the fact that it's now been removed would pretty much prove that point.

I was just repeating what a more senior member of my organization told me. I'm not surprised at all that it got pulled. I just find it unfortunate that NFHS finds it necessary to obfuscate the game by making the rules more difficult to obtain.
I know that you can make the case that by ensuring that the only source is the official source, you prevent a certain amount of poisoning of the well. But from the perspective of someone who is just trying to know what the rules are in order to teach, learn, etc., they're trying to enforce a revenue source out of the books. There has got to be better ways to make money.
The smartphone app is cute, but I have a 4-year old phone and a 8-year old computer that can read pdf files. Seriously, why not just release the friggin' pdf's? Why does everyone have to use this smartphone golden hammer?

BktBallRef Tue Nov 01, 2011 04:23pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ia-Ref (Post 796838)
That's intersting because when the new NFHS/Arbiter started up, I was able to get the Rules & Casebook online at their site.

As I've already stated:

I also have access to the pdf files through the NFHS Arbiter site.

This is the last year they will release them in pdf form.

Quote:

Originally Posted by jchamp (Post 796889)
Seriously, why not just release the friggin' pdf's?

Feel free to email Mike Meenan at [email protected] and ask him.

HLin NC Tue Nov 01, 2011 06:55pm

Quote:

I just find it unfortunate that NFHS finds it necessary to obfuscate the game by making the rules more difficult to obtain.
If it is their organization's property, why should they allow every start-up youth league in America to copy off their rules for free and then addend at will?

Robert Goodman Tue Nov 01, 2011 07:38pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by HLin NC (Post 796912)
If it is their organization's property, why should they allow every start-up youth league in America to copy off their rules for free and then addend at will?

Because that's how Fed got theirs!

JugglingReferee Tue Nov 01, 2011 09:21pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robert Goodman (Post 796916)
Because that's how Fed got theirs!

Microsoft swiped an OS and then expanded on it and now claims it as theirs! :eek::eek:


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