You Make the Call...

[waltjp]

Originally Posted by Robert Goodman

When the non-players ran onto the field, I'm assuming that some of them didn't have helmets on, and that all of them thought the ball was dead. That's a dangerous situation for which play should've been whistled dead.

What rule are you using to justify this? The only time you stop the play is when the ball carrier loses his helmet, not any of the other players on the field.

[gtwbam]

Broken62:
I concur with you 100%.
This is definitely a non-player foul
which should be assessed as an USC foul from the succeeding spot.

I'll even go as far to say, you can add another 2 or 3 USC fouls against B for the additional non-players on the field.

[Robert Goodman]

Originally Posted by waltjp

What rule are you using to justify this? The only time you stop the play is when the ball carrier loses his helmet, not any of the other players on the field.

I don't know the specific rule, but I believe you are empowered to stop play when a dangerous situation not an ordinary part of the game occurs. In this case it's people entering the field not suited up and thinking the game had ended.

I'm just going by the originally posted description. If, as some viewers are writing, it was just a matter of a few non-players entering a short way into the field briefly without interfering with play and quickly getting off, then it would not be such a dangerous situation.

[waltjp]

Originally Posted by Robert Goodman

I don't know the specific rule, but I believe you are empowered to stop play when a dangerous situation not an ordinary part of the game occurs. In this case it's people entering the field not suited up and thinking the game had ended.

I'm just going by the originally posted description. If, as some viewers are writing, it was just a matter of a few non-players entering a short way into the field briefly without interfering with play and quickly getting off, then it would not be such a dangerous situation.

So what you're suggesting is that anytime the offense has a breakaway run the defensive players on the sideline should run onto the field with their helmets off in order to have the play whistled dead.

Why not just enforce the current rules as written that address a situation like this instead of making them up as you go along?

[Robert Goodman]

Originally Posted by waltjp

So what you're suggesting is that anytime the offense has a breakaway run the defensive players on the sideline should run onto the field with their helmets off in order to have the play whistled dead.

But they wouldn't do that, because the penalty would be an awarded touchdown. Isn't that the rule for when a player comes off the bench to stop an apparent touchdown run?

[BroKen62]

Originally Posted by Robert Goodman

But they wouldn't do that, because the penalty would be an awarded touchdown. Isn't that the rule for when a player comes off the bench to stop an apparent touchdown run?

Boy, me or you one needs a new rule book.
First of all, there is no rule that gives an official authority to blow a play dead, except for a RUNNER whose helmet has come off.
Secondly, if an official does blow it dead, it's an inadvertent whistle (vulgar language where i come from )
Third, you are correct in your interpretation of a player coming off the bench to stop an apparent touchdown run. If a sub came out and tackled the ball carrier when it was obvious he would have scored, then the Referee can invoke the unfair act rule and award a touchdown.

But the proper call for nonplayers on the field with their hats off during a touchdown scoring play is to let the runner score, then give A the option to accept the USC foul on either the try or the kickoff.
All this is black and white in the 2009 copy of the NFHS rule book.

[parepat]

Anyone know what caused the USC?

[bisonlj]

Originally Posted by BroKen62

Boy, me or you one needs a new rule book.
First of all, there is no rule that gives an official authority to blow a play dead, except for a RUNNER whose helmet has come off.
Secondly, if an official does blow it dead, it's an inadvertent whistle (vulgar language where i come from )
Third, you are correct in your interpretation of a player coming off the bench to stop an apparent touchdown run. If a sub came out and tackled the ball carrier when it was obvious he would have scored, then the Referee can invoke the unfair act rule and award a touchdown.

But the proper call for nonplayers on the field with their hats off during a touchdown scoring play is to let the runner score, then give A the option to accept the USC foul on either the try or the kickoff.
All this is black and white in the 2009 copy of the NFHS rule book.

We had a very similar situation happen to us this year when a team thought the game was over and came running on the field. They realized the ball was still live so they ran back off and never affected the play. Team A didn't score so the game ended but their coaches were screaming at us for not flagging them. We talked about it in the locker room and knew that even if we flagged it, it would not have extended the period so the game was over either way. What we struggled with was what foul would actually apply. We ran through everything that has been mentioned here (illegal substitution, illegal participation, USC, even SLW). We checked with several other officials as well and never really got a definitive answer.

[BroKen62]

Originally Posted by bisonlj

We talked about it in the locker room and knew that even if we flagged it, it would not have extended the period so the game was over either way.

Actually, it did make a difference. If you had thrown the flag for illegal substitution or illegal participation, since both of those are live ball fouls, A would have had the opportunity to run an untimed down. If you got them for nonplayers being on the field, that's treated as a dead ball unsportsmanlike, therefore no untimed down.
3.2. ART. 3 . . . A period must be extended by an untimed down if during the last timed down of the period, one of the following occured:
a. There was a foul by either team and the penalty is accepted, except for
those fouls listed in 3-3-4b.

ART. 4 . . . A period shall not be extended by an untimed down if during the
last timed down of the period, one of the following occurs:
a. When the defense fouls during a successful try/field goal and the offended
team accepts the results of the play with enforcement of the penalty from
the succeeding spot.
b. There was a foul by either team and the penalty is accepted for:
1. unsportsmanlike fouls,
2. non-player fouls,
3. fouls that specify a loss of down, or
4. fouls that are enforced on the subsequent kickoff as in Rule 8-2-2.
NOTE: The score is cancelled in the event of an accepted foul that specifies a loss of down.

[Robert Goodman]

Originally Posted by BroKen62

Boy, me or you one needs a new rule book.
First of all, there is no rule that gives an official authority to blow a play dead, except for a RUNNER whose helmet has come off.

So if the marching band comes onto the field thinking the ball is dead and one of them is likely to have his trombone slid up his wazoo, you let play continue?

[Rich]

Originally Posted by Robert Goodman

So if the marching band comes onto the field thinking the ball is dead and one of them is likely to have his trombone slid up his wazoo, you let play continue?

Yes, see Stanford/Cal.

[jaybird]

Originally Posted by Robert Goodman

So if the marching band comes onto the field thinking the ball is dead and one of them is likely to have his trombone slid up his wazoo, you let play continue?

Absolutely!
Then he would sing a different tune every time he passed gas!! More importantly, it would send a message loud and clear to keep the d@mn band off the field.