PSU/OSU Illegal Batting Question
 

For those folks who saw the PSU/OSU game, the OSU QB had the ball knocked out of his possession behind the line of scrimmage. The loose ball landed on the ground and was almost at rest when a PSU player intentionally batted the ball forward toward OSU's goal line where another PSU player recovered the ball.

Should this have been ruled "Illegal Batting"?

I will have the video posted later today. Very tough call to make in a scrum like that. Easy to see how covering officials could have ruled player was just reaching for ball and his hand knocked it forward. If the call had been made it would have been supportable by video.

I thought the exact same thing when I saw it on video. It was clearly a bat with the back of the players hand and not an attempt to recover it. It's hard to say what view the official had. It appears the R had a clear view. It's also a situation in the heat of the moment and a very tough judgement call.

Definitely a bat, but that would have been real hard to pick up at game speed, I could see the R calling it either way, and being supported in either case.

Video:

http://www.youtube.com/v/6lHaJBxBq2k

Looks to me more like he was reaching for the ball moreso than batting it... but that's JMHO

From TXMike's video, the announcers stated the the PSU player knocked it back to keep it away from OSU.

If that is what the announcer said then it is safe to assume that is NOT what happened

YouTube - ohio state vs penn state (2008) close game, 13-6

go to the 30 sec mark, psu player whacked the ball.

LOL. Good point, Mike.

looks like a muffed recovery to me...

This Buckeye fan really wanted a batting call, but given the way that play developed and all that was going on, I wasn't expecting to see it thrown. I wasn't even sure about it when it first was shown, and we were able to see it on my buddy's 50+" HD screen.
The QB made a bone-headed play, that set the rest of it in motion. As far as I'm concerned, his actions should be more important than making what can be a really picky call.

I see refbuz is wearing blue shades!
:cool:

Looking at the players motion on my DVR/HD combination from the replays from ESPN, IMHO, it was definitely a Illegal Bat. The defensive player seeing that he would not have a chance at the ball, intentionally knocked the ball 4-5 yards toward OSU's goal line. This was an advantage gained and clearly against the rules. The fact that the OSU QB had the ball knocked away by a great defensive play by PSU should not be a factor in determining if PSU #46 committed a foul.

YouTube - The Fumble: Penn State Beats Ohio State in Columbus

nah, looks to me like the "bat" came as a result of 2 players jumping on his back in an effort to recover the ball.

I think a case could made either way to support a call/no call.

My name obviously gives away my loyalties. However, I would be hard pressed to say that this was an obvious illegal batting. If it were called, it could have been justified, but I would think that the majority of officials who saw this play live would have called nothing, and I would agree with them.

No, not at all. The announcer tried to sell that, but it was no different than any other runner's decision, and if it hadn't been for a stellar play to knock the ball (which was being carried on the proper side) away, it could well have been a good run.

Robert

I wish we knew someone that was in the replay booth so we could know why it wasn't reviewed and corrected. I guess the booth can't fix this one, right?

Not only that, the announcers went on how the QB made a decision to run to the side instead of straight ahead. The thing is they have no idea if the QB was told by the coaches to do that. Maybe he was coached to run to the side because they thought he would have a better chance over there.

That's possible. There was a lot of profanity and two frightened dogs from where I was watching. Nobody was really concerned about the bat because it wasn't completely, holy-roller obvious.
Maybe he didn't want to risk a dive when the line had been choked, maybe he saw daylight to the right side. That can be talked about for weeks or months. Tressel isn't known for taking many risks, so I can see them thinking that the 3rd & 1 is their last chance to make yardage before having to punt. That can drive you to do a lot of things once you're in the thick.

What a great definition of what makes a foul worth calling. I'm going to use this from now on...;)

Can't the replay official tell if it was a bat? Is he not allowed to call an obvious bat in this case, when it means the whole game?

Come on guys this is just wrong!

It looked pretty obvious like a bat to me. Are the college batting rules different then NFHS?

2008 NCAA® FOOTBALL RULES
RULE 2-8 / DEFINITIONS FR -45
SECTION 10. Fumbling, Muffing, Batting,
Touching or Blocking a Kick
Batting
ARTICLE 3. Batting the ball is intentionally striking it or intentionally
changing its direction with the hands or arms.

RULE 9-3 / CONDUCT OF PLAYERS AND OTHERS SUBJECT TO RULE FR -129
SECTION 4. Batting and Kicking
Batting a Loose Ball
c. No player shall bat other loose balls forward in the field of play or in any
direction if the ball is in the end zone (Rule 2-2-3-a)

PENALTY—15 yards from the basic spot and loss of down if the loss
of down is not in conflict with other rules [S31 and S9]
[Exception: No loss of down if the foul occurs when a legal
scrimmage kick is beyond the neutral zone (Rules 10-2-2-c,
d, e and f)].

So according to the rules it is ok for B to bat a loose ball backward in the field of play?

I thought it was a bat when I saw the play live. But on replay I didn't think so. Someone in this thread said the ball was backhanded, but because one could easily be slow in wrist movement, a player could hit the ball with the back of his hand while trying to recover a rolling ball. And if you're not sure it was intentional, it wasn't.

Robert

It does not look obvious enough to call this a penalty. I was thinking that the player might have batted the ball, but it would be a very hard sell. Do not go looking for stuff to call.

Peace

Seems even a Penn State player thinks it was a bat:

From the Centre Daily Times:

Recovery effort

Penn State safety Mark Rubin made the play of the game, if not the season, in Columbus, knocking the ball out of the hands of Ohio State quarterback Terrelle Pryor on a quarterback sneak in the fourth quarter. But if not for linebackers Navorro Bowman and Tyrell Sales, the Buckeyes might have been able to recover the fumble and pin the Nittany Lions in their own territory with a punt.

Bowman, who has forced two fumbles this season, dove on the ball at the Buckeyes’ 38-yard line after a mad scramble.

“I was just trying to slow it down with my eyes and hands and just fall on it,” he said.

Sales knocked Ohio State tailback Chris Wells to the turf, giving Bowman the chance to fall on the ball.

“If he hadn’t done that, there’s no telling who would have got the ball,” Bowman said. “It just comes from awareness, having guys keep the ball alive.”

There were 2 bats when the ball was loose after the fumble. It was a "foreward bat" for PSU #46, and then it was a "backward bat" for PSU #10.

YouTube - Penn State at Ohio State - Fumble recovery

I'd be willing to bat, I mean bet that when the season is over and PSU has won their BCS game, the player is finally going to come out and say if I had not batted that ball in the OSU game, we'd not have been here to win another championship.

I am surprised he has not done so already I do not think there are that many folks yet who recognize if he did it deliberately it was a foul.

Of course they don't realize it was illegal. To them it was a smart play.

and since it wasn't called, pure Genius! :)