football bicep bands
 

Can someone let me know if in illinois high school football are bicep bands not approved. Can the team get an USC penalty or has this been changed. thanks

Federation says
 

Rule 1.5.3m (page 25) Uniform adornments. Penalty 15 yards USC (page 26). It would depend on if your state calls BB's adornments.

I believe this was covered in the rules video.

Illegal.

It was covered in the video. It is illegal by rule. It was illegal by IHSA interpretations in the past. It really is that simple.

Peace

They are not supposed to be legal anywhere, but unfortunately occassionaly ignored in my area by some:mad:.
Who knows what some other state office might say about it, but lets not even go there.:D I'm worn out by all this A11 debate.

From my point of view, this issue was hotly debated long before I knew what the A-11. At least I might never see the A-11 this year. Chances are we will have to deal with these stupid armbands and have to deal with them on a weekly basis in real football games, not just an internet discussion.

Peace

They can wear wristbands (on their wrists). Nothing else.

Please tell me how you cam justify ejecting a player for wearing an armband. I don't seem to find that in my rule book. Is that a state association interpretation?

They are defined as wrist bands and may not be worn more than 3 inches toward the elbow. If you tell someone they must remove it and they don't follow your instructions it's USC. If they do it again it's a second USC and an automatic ejection. This was a POE last year.

Really? Where?

2007 NFHS FOOTBALL POINTS OF EMPHASIS

PLAYER EQUIPMENT AND UNIFORM ADORNMENTS
A greater focus must be made by coaches, players and officials on players having and properly wearing mandatory football equipment as required by NFHS Football Rules. A parallel focus must also be on not allowing players to wear illegal equipment or adornments.
Through normal observation, officials should attempt to verify that each player is legally equipped prior to the ball becoming live, and if illegal equipment is detected or required equipment is missing, that player must rectify the problem or leave the game.
Prior to the ball becoming live, if the officials are unable to detect the illegal or missing equipment, and the player(s) are observed wearing illegal equipment or participating without the mandatory equipment during the down, a foul must be called.
Helmet: Each player shall wear a helmet with a face mask which met the NOCSAE test standard at the time of manufacture. This helmet shall also have a visible exterior warning label regarding the risk of injury. The helmet shall be secured by a properly fastened chin strap with at least four snaps. The helmet shall not be used as the primary point of contact as in butt-blocking, face-tackling or spearing. Whenever the helmet of a ball carrier comes completely off, the ball becomes dead and the down is ended.
Pants: Knee pads are mandatory equipment that must be worn over the knee and must be of a specified thickness. Pants shall be worn that cover the knee and knee pads. Pants worn that do not meet this requirement becomes an unsportsmanlike foul charged to the head coach for violating his verification that all his players are legally equipped.
Knee Braces: Knee braces are not mandatory equipment. Knee braces may be worn to protect or prevent injury provided they meet the following requirements: They must not be made of hard, unyielding material, unless the hinges are covered on both sides and all of its edges overlap and the braces are worn under the pants. If the covering is not provided by the manufacturer, any portion of the brace that is of a hard material that extends below the pants must be covered. Any other hard substance across the front of the leg must covered with at least ½ inch of closed-cell, slow-recovery rubber or other material of the same minimum thickness and having similar physical external exposure.
Jersey: A legal jersey is mandatory equipment. The jersey shall be long enough to reach the top of the pants when a player is standing with his arms and hands down to his side. If the jersey is longer than just reaching the top of the pants, then it must be tucked inside the pants. Tear-away jerseys are not legal. Jerseys that cover just the shoulder pads are not legal. Jerseys that reach the top of the pants in length, but are tucked up under the bottom of the shoulder pads are not legal. Jerseys that have been altered resulting in taped or tied knot-like protrusions are not legal. Any hard surface auxiliary attachments to the shoulder pads must be fully covered by the jersey. A bicep pad connected to the shoulder pad must be fully covered by the jersey. Rib pads and back protectors must be fully covered by the jersey. Ball-colored jerseys or a jersey that enhances a player's contact with the ball is not legal.
Towels and Sweatbands: One unmarked moisture-absorbing white towel not less than 4 inches wide and 12 inches in length and no greater than 18 inches in width and 36 inches in width and/or one moisture-absorbing sweatband worn on one or both wrists beginning at the base of the thumb and extending no more than 3 inches toward the elbow are the only two uniform adornments that are legal.
Biceps Pads: May be worn on the upper arms. The plastic material covering this protective pad does not have to be covered if there is no cracked or cutting edge on the plastic surface. If such cracks or cutting edges exist on the plastic surface, the pads would not be legal unless properly covered. If the biceps pads are attached to the shoulder pads, they must be fully covered by the jersey.
Forearm Pads: Forearm pads are auxiliary equipment that may be worn provided they are sanctioned by the umpire as being soft, nonabrasive, or nonhardening material.. They may be anchored on each end by athletic tape. Tape, bandage or support wrap may be worn on the hand or forearm to protect an existing injury if sanctioned by the umpire. If the tape, bandage, or support wrap does not exceed three thicknesses, they may be worn without inspection or approval. Ball-colored pads or gloves are illegal equipment. Penalty-marker colored pads or gloves are illegal equipment. Any transverse stripe on the sleeve below the elbow is illegal.
Play Cards: Are not considered uniform adornments and may be worn on the forearm. (NFHS Interpretation)
Hard Substance (Casts): A cast in its final form may not be worn on the hand, wrist, forearm, or elbow unless it is padded as specified and its wearing is directed in writing by a licensed medical physician. Unless proper authorization is provided by a licensed medical physician, no hard material may be worn on the hand, wrist, forearm or elbow regardless of how well it is padded.
Jewelry: Jewelry shall not be worn. Religious and medical alert medals are not considered jewelry. A religious medal must be taped and worn under the uniform. A medical alert medal must be taped and may be visible.
Eye Shields: Eye shields which are not totally clear, not molded, or not rigid may not be worn. Eye shields must permit 100% light transmission to be legal. A tinted shield may not be worn even if a physician's letter is available saying the tinted shield is necessary.

Grab a 2007 book and look at the POE.

Partner, this is the 2007 NFHS POE on PLAYER EQUIPMENT AND UNIFORM ADORNMENTS directly from the Rule Book.

And it ain't in there. But I'm still looking!

I believe that's exactly what was posted.

Actually you can define them as a wrist band or a uniform adorment.
Either way they are illegal when worn other than on the wrist.

So you're saying that the NFHS rule book does not tell us to eject players for not removing bicep bands but your state association feels strongly about this, feels it's not good for the game and has taken it upon themselves to take a stand against this?

That's all I need to know! Thanks!

Rule 1-5-3 Illegal Equipment

ART. 3 . . . Illegal equipment. No player shall participate while wearing illegal equipment. This applies to any equipment, which in the opinion of the umpire is dangerous, confusing or inappropriate. Illegal equipment shall always include but is not limited to:

a. Ball-colored helmets, jerseys, patches, pads or gloves, penalty-marker colored pads or gloves. Any transverse stripe on the sleeve below the elbow.

PENALTY: Unsportsmanlike conduct (Arts. 2, 3, 5) – (S27) — 15 yards. See 9-8-1h. Failure to properly wear required equipment during a down (Art. 6) – (S27, S23) – 5 yards. See 3-6-2d for failure to properly wear required
equipment when the ball is about to become live.


Rule 3-6-2 Action or inaction which prevents promptness in putting the ball in play is delay of game. This includes:

d. Failure to properly wear legal or required player equipment when the ball is about to become live.

PENALTY: Delay of game – (Arts. 2a,b,c,e,f; 4) – (S7-21); (Art. 2d) – (S7-21-23) – 5 yards;


Rule 9-8-1 No coach, substitute, trainer or other team attendant shall act in an unsportsmanlike manner once the officials assume authority for the contest. Examples are, but not limited to:

h. Failure of the head coach, following verification, to have his player(s) wear or use legal and/or required equipment.

PENALTY: Nonplayer fouls (Art. 1a through j) – (S27), (S7-27 if dead ball) – 15 yards.

That's all I need to know! Thanks!
 

:D BANG

:D :D :D :D

No BBR once again you are incorrect.
 

No, BBR, once again you have misquoted me, just like you do on the NFHS webpage.
I gave up making childish attitude statements such as your "Thats all I need to know! Thanks" (listed above) when I reached puberty.
You do not attempt to engage in a discussion rather you find it necessary to slam anyone and everyone at will.
You have shown us all your acute abilty to copy and paste rules onto a thread! (Impressive to say the least)
You have the unique abilty to have an answer for everything yet a solution for none!
You are BBR, in the strongest sense of the term, a Legend in your own mind!

This is very interesting, HL. KWH has been busting on you, me and the NCHSAA through PM and posts because our state rep has followed his convictions and made a decision tha the A-11 is not good for high school football in the state of North Carolina.

Yet, when his state makes a similiar decision concerning illegal equipment, and that's alright. They're doing the right thing. Hmmm.

Then, when challenged on it, he deletes his post.

Wow.

No partner, I didn't misquote you. In fact, I quoted your post which is fortunate since you deleted.

Really? You mean like when you wrote, "Good luck in your season you arrogant a$$!" in a PM to me?

Thank you, I think. I notice that you copy and paste rules as well, so I'm unsure why that's an issue for you.

Never claimed to have a solution or an answer for every situation. But I don have opinions that I share from time to time. I thought that's what discussion forums are all about.

So you gave up making childish attitude statements when you were in puberty, eh? It's a shame you didn't give up personal insults and name calling.

Say what you want but your state association has taken a stand on a situation that they feel is good for high school football in your state. So has mine. The best thing for you to do is get over it.

I can honestly say that as a crew chief and referee, I will NOT be calling an USC on a player wearing arm bands. This is real simple. When you see it, tell the kid thats considered to be illegal equipment and they'll need to remove it. If they balk, tell the coach and this will fix the situation.

Here in Indiana, the coaches vote on post season assignments. Throwing an USC on something as trivial as this is a pretty good way to make sure you are sitting at home fro the first round of the play-offs.

Are there other rules the coaches ding you on when you enforce them?

The original question on this thread was, "Can the team get an USC penalty (for wearing armbands) or has this been changed. thanks". The absolute answer to that questions is "Yes", but the better question might have been SHOULD an USC penalty be assessed for wearing armbands, and that answer is not so universal.

Whether we each like it, or not, the NFHS rules identify this equipment as illegal and there is a prescribed penalty for playing with illegal equipment. They have decided the equipment poses a potential hazard, and it's their responsibility to render such judgments, not our's. However, equally important to our knowing the rules of the game is our judgment in knowing when to enforce them.

If a State Association, or a more localized Board, issued a specific modification or called special attention to this application of this rule, it seems logical to follow those instructions. However, as we've done for the last 100+ years we try and avoid the necessity of penalizing certain situations by what we call "preventive officiating", such as when we see a mouth piece dangling, or a chin strap unbuckled.

We're on the field for 30 minutes before each game, and inappropriate arm bands are pretty visible, even more so than prohibited knots tied under the armpits or on the back of jerseys. It seems a lot more productive to address this issue with the coaching staff before the game (emphasis on "address" rather than discuss) and prevent any subsequent oversight by refusing to allow any player, so equipped, from entering the game.

Those efforts should prevent 99.9% of the problems from occuring. If you find it necessary to apply the remedy proscribed by rule in the remaining 0.01%, it shouldn't surprise anyone.

KWH got the same message we did
 

Following the book and calling it an adornment it would be a UC, 2 and you are gone, right? Also 9-5-1g Refusing to comply with an official's request-Penalty UC, page 73 The second unsportsmanlike results in a disqualification.

It would be nice if we actually followed the book, the amendments are a pain at times.

I'm sure there are. The coaches vote has no feedback to the governing body aside from the vote itself. Common sense lends itself to the idea that you should focus on penalties that relate to the fairness of the contest and safety rather than nit-picking over the presence of an underarmore bicept band or a "live strong" yellow wrist band.

Great... the p*ssing contests have found their way to this board too. I guess I will have to stop checking this one now like the NFHS board. :mad:

Why waste the time reading all the childish banter?

Is everyone that disagrees with you needed to responds from you in a childish way?

Someone disagrees with you and they have an inflated ego?

Even though I agree with you on this topic, but when are you just going to just disagree with someone without name calling like you are 5 years old?

BTW, we were told the very same thing about this rule. If the coach does not comply you have options to penalize this. That is the first time I heard this, but that is what our Rules Interpreter said.

Peace

As an umpire, I don't think I'd want to start off a game dinging players or coaches for bicep bands. This is the worst way to start things off and I'm sure I'd get an earful from my wings. How about working with the coach to make sure that the players remove the bands and use the USC as a last resort? The rule may be in black and white, but some common sense has to factor in here.

Scott

Hi,

Since no one else pointed it out (someone refered to the rules, but you had asked where in the POE it was found), I have emphasised the section that seems to cover it.

No. The question was where in the POE does it say that a player should be ejected if he returns to the games wearing bicep bands after he's been told to take them off.

Why not just send the offending player off until the illegal equipment is removed? Once a coach realizes he's having to keep sub'ing players because they want to wear this crap, maybe he'll finally realize it's in his own best interest to keep his players from wearing it.

There is no provision in the rules suggesting a player can, or should be, disqualified for returning to play after being told to correct or remove illegal or defective equipment or to add required equipment.

The simple solution is found in NF: 1.6.5, "when any required player equipment is missing, or when illegal equipment is found, correction shall be made before participation.

The player always gets to choose, either he can continue to wear the illegal equipment or he can play. He can't do both. The reason there is emphasis to detect such equipment problems BEFORE the ball is snapped is to avoid anyone from playing with illegal equipment.

There appears to be some confusion over bicep bands and sweatbands. A bicep band is an elastic band that fits around the bicep (that's why it is called a bicep band.) Some states have chosen to declare them illegal.

Some officials confuse a bicep band with a sweatband. A sweatband is a cotton/elastic band ranging in size from 1/2 inch to 3 inches. By rule, they are legal if worn up to 3 inches above the wrist. You see many NFL players wearing these often with the color to match the uniform usually just above the elbow which is illegal in NFHS.

Usually if a player is found wearing illegal equipment you tell them to take it off as it does not have a material affect on the game so why penalize it. The exception is when players are found without a tailbone protector which is exceptionally dangerous and could create a liability for us as officials.

Ed, It's not the states that rule the bicep band illegal, it's the NFHS. A bicep band is not a piece of legal equipment - it's an adornment and, except for a towel or sweatband, adornments are illegal.

There's no confusion. A sweatband is a sweatband is a sweatband. You can wear a sweatband within three inches of the base of the thumb. You cannot wear one anywhere else on your body. Calling it a bicep band does not change the fact that it is a sweatband and is illegal if warn anywhere other than the base of the tumb.

I stand corrected, kinda. The traditional bicep band was intended to protect athletes from elbow injuries particularly tennis players. They are made typically of rubber to provide protection without restricting circulation. They can be worn if a doctor's note is provided and the band is covered by 1/2 inch thick closed-cell polyurethane.

This stuff all the manufacturers are calling "bicep bands" are nothing more than an attempt to sell more stuff. They have become a fashion statement, nothing more or nothing less. In fact, I wear them in the gym and other than looks they provide absolutely no value.

Now you've got me confused. The only doctor's note I'm accepting is clearence for a player to participate while wearing a cast.

It's really simple. If a player is protecting an injury to his bicep it has to be protected by the closed cel foam and there must be a doctor's note. Otherwise, anything three inches above the wrist is illegal.

Every now and then, perhaps not often enough, the rule-makers announce a decision that makes our lives easier. So it is with these obnoxious "bands" that have no practical function, other than to serve as a fashion statement, and pose a minimal safety concern regarding fingers getting caught up in them.

Rather than develop a multi-paragraph, convoluted definition of what may, or may not be acceptable, the rule-makers decided simply to say, "NO". If you want to get embrioled in a never ending debate with coachs, players and even possibly parents as to the perceived harmlessness or inoccuessness of these uniform adornments, that's up to you. A simple, "NO", on the other hand seems like a much simpler and clearer response.

This is the type issue, consistency, will be helpful in eliminating.

Can you please cite that rule?

This is at least the second post in this thread that has misquoted the rule on a sweatband. It is not worn "within 3 inches of the base of the thumb," it can extend no more than 3 inches from the base of the thumb. There is a definite difference. http://img65.imageshack.us/img65/8338/2cents3fo.gifhttp://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y26...er-cheveux.gif