Black Pants Lions vs Cowboys
 

I noticed the officials for this game are in the black sweat pants. Doesn't Detriot have a domed stadium? I thought the black pants were only for cold weather. Are the NFL officials finding that they prefer the black sweat pants to knickers and starting to wear them in the warmer games?

Frankly, I can see why they would like them better. Better layering options with enough extra room to move. Also there is no more dealing with referee socks or knickers. As an official with large calfs I hate the socks and knickers of my traditional uniform.

Anyway, I'm not baggin on tradition I just thought it interesting that there might be a possible trend.

I'm 100% positive that they aren't sweat pants. :)

:)

Whether they are or not they look like them. They use the Reebok Play Dry material. I have some Reebok sweat pants that are made from the same stuff and as far as I can tell are similar to the NFL pants with the exception of the white stripe.

Maybe our definition of sweat pants are different. :D

I'm a bigger guy. I actually highly prefer the knickers over the play dry pant which a lot of guys wear for those rainy day junior high games and recommended so I got a pair. I prefer kickers, maybe I'm just weird.

To most of us over 50, sweat pants are made from cotton, similar to sweatshirts. They appear a little "fuzzy" and have elastic sewn inside the bottom of the leg so they "blouse" slightly at the ankle.

What the NFL officials are wearing more closely resembles what us old farts would calling running suit pants, joggin pants, warm-ups, etc. They are made from a synthetic material and definitely are not "fuzzy."

Thanks for clarifying for the youngster. ;)

Flippin' geriatrics! You need to get with the times. hahaha:p

You aren't weird. It's a personal preference thing. I'm also bigger and my legs are the size of an NFL running back. Even the relaxed fit knickers are tight on me and present few layering options. I love my "warm up" pants that I wear for the little guys. I wear thermals and some fleece under them and stay toasty.

I'm hoping that the NFL pants catch on for the amatuer officials.

[quote=IceGator8]I noticed the officials for this game are in the black sweat pants. Doesn't Detriot have a domed stadium? I thought the black pants were only for cold weather. Are the NFL officials finding that they prefer the black sweat pants to knickers and starting to wear them in the warmer games?

[quote]

Detroit is a domed stadium.

The problem with black sweats would be having a standard uniform black pant for all officials to wear. The Reebok and UnderArmour pants are nice but you can picture some guy would appear wearing the old cotton elastic at the bottom pant.

I lke them and would like to be able to wear them in high school.

REPLY: Spoke to an NFL friend who told me that his referee made the recommendation to Pereira that they not limit the black pants to cold weather. Apparently Mr. P liked it...otherwise you would have seen knickers yesterday in the Pontiac Dome.

I understand. I guess any switch would have to be regulated somehow. It would help if the major suppliers started to offer the correct brand and styles as an alternative.

If the black pants do become acceptable at lower levels I think the crew cheifs would have to be diligent in making sure their guys were equipped with the proper pant. I love the idea of the black pants but I'd never let someone on my crew show up for a game in the regular cotton sweats with the elastic on bottom.

Unless they've changed them since last year, they are not the microfiber Reebok (or other) material. They are the same exact material as the Honigs Elite knicker. I've seen and felt these pants.

They don't look good with a short sleeved shirt, and they especially look bad with the guy in a white hate. This was a bad experiment. They need to go back to the knickers.

I find the balance between tradition and new ideas interesting. When I started doing baseball the blue Elbeco postman shirts were the standard. When the Major League umpires switched to a navy polo style shirt the old school umpires in my association moaned and groaned quite a bit. Along with a few others I adopted the new style immediately much to the chagrin of the old school guys. It was easy for me to see why the new style was better. In spite of the protests of some of the more traditional umpires everyone was wearing the navy shirts within two years.

Frankly I think the old ways of doing things need to receive a hard look every once in a while just to see if things can be done better. If tradition can be maintained then I'm fine with that but if another style is clearly superior as far as performance and comfort then I think it should be adopted. I think a lot of the NFL guys are starting to find that the black pants are better than knickers and that is the reason the request was made.

Anyway, the purpose of this is not to rub anything in the face of my more experienced bretheren. I respect your contributions to our vocation and appreciate the wise advice I've received.

There has been some interesting commentary about this on the various officiating forums. It seems there are a number of football officials that dislike the knickers. This surprises me a bit as I really like the look of knickers and striped socks but then I am a bit old fashioned. :confused:

I can respect that. However, I think knickers are antiquated. Believe it or not I used to wear them snow skiing when I was a kid (I'm only 37). Back then you could still buy wool knickers and I thought they would be cool. It turns out my regular pants were much better.

I'm only 24 so knickers are especially antiquated for my generation; however, I still like the look of them (goes back to that whole old fashioned thing).

I do wonder how the pants are working from a functional aspect? It seems with the nature of football, there would be a greater chance for the pant legs to snag on a player. In my case, I'd be worried about tripping over them. :D

How can a uniform part that was the only one authorized just two years ago, and still being worn today be "antiquated?" It's not a computer.

We need a better sense of time and history.

If we are going to add black pants for comfort reasons can we also add shorts for comfort reasons, especially for those early August games.

As long as the pasty white legs that match the color of the shorts are not included. :eek:

I think from a function and fit perspective they are antiquated. They key isn't that they were the only authorized uniform pant two years ago. The key is how long they've been the only authorized uniform pant.

Traditionalists hold a lot of power when it comes to changing things. It's true in baseball and football. However, sometimes tradition impedes progress.

My sense of history is fine. Why are you trying to turn this into a fight? I've gone out of my way to be friendly towards those who might like tradition.

I would have no problem with this. My state association allows shorts for JV ball. It's up to the individual crew whether they are white or black. The debate surrounding allowing shorts is a perfect illustration of my intent when I started this thread. The old guard fought the change for a long time but eventually shorts prevailed. Now there isn't one crew in my association that uses knickers for warm JV games and that includes the old guard that fought against the shorts. The shorts are simply more comfortable in warm weather. I think a the pants would be much better in warm weather as well. The pants have a looser fit that would allow air to circulate.

I doubt the quality of the officiating would suffer if shorts were allowed for warm varsity games.

No fight intended. I'm just pointing out that something comtemporary is not antiquated.

If you don't like knickers, fine. I am not emotionally involved in that issue. As a teacher, however, I have an annoying penchant for accuracy.

As for a sense of history, I find that many people consider 50 years ago, 75 years ago and 100 years ago to be a long time. Those with a sense of history realize that they are not.

As a highly educated individual I feel that sense of history should usually be determined by the age of the subject being discussed. It's not as if we are dealing with the history of music or religion.

Darn! I'm educated in both of these.

With officials, they will be.

What about the history of trousers? :D

Scooby I'm afraid you're right about that...

I agree. What we have here is two smart people who perceive history a little differently. Neither is right or wrong. We just hold a different opinion.

where would a guy even get a pair of those NFL black pants...I'd love the option in our games. Are they only given to the NFL guys? It certainly appears that way.

I imagine that Reebok has them made custom for the NFL. Give them a few years and they'll be commercially available.

The NFHS Officials Manual describes, in detail, the required uniform for HS Officials in 48 States. It includes both "all-white tapered knickers, as well as "By State Association adoption, white officiating shorts (5-inch inseam) may be worn in place of the traditional knickers if worn by the entire crew."

The black pants worn by the NFL officials are designed to go with their proprietory striped shirts, which cannot be worn without permission of the NFL. There is no functional perspective, other than fabric, that differentiates these pants from knickers, and I suspect whatever fabric is used for these pants could be used for white knickers.

A major purpose of the new NFL uniforms was to differentiate NFL officials from officials at other levels, so the league could control how these uniforms might be used in commercials.

The purpose of the current officials uniform is to clearly differentiate officials from players on the field, something white knickers seem to do quite well. If you don't work at the NFL level, and fashion consciousness is a serious concern, there's always soccer.

Do not assume all 48 (member) States require this. I do not see a lot of options of the football uniform like other sports at this time, but I am sure if a state wanted to change (like other sports have), they would. And my state does not even use the Officials Manuals anymore, so it is possible if there was another type of football uniform, they could change. It is not likely, but possible.

Peace

Please, please, please.

Do not resurrect year old posts. I did not check the date and was elated to see a post by Garth. I thought he was back.

I like the black pants. Up close they look comfortable and professional.

I think the pants would make the dunlap disease sufferers look better than they do in the knickers. *whistling*

Dunlap disease is an American phenomenon. :p

How would we look in black knickers? A slimming effect. ;)

http://www.kenn.com/images/ref_black_knickers.jpg

In AZ, we wear black shorts for everything below varsity. Not white. Only varsity wears knickers.

If you lived here, you'd understand why. :)

As is "furniture" disease, you know... when you chest falls into your drawers.