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Ed Hickland Thu Nov 08, 2007 12:04pm

Covering Field Goal with 5-man mechanics (NFHS)
 
Reading through five man mechanics for a field goal, you place two officials under the goal posts, one official on the line, umpire in the defensive backfield and referee in offensive backfield positioned to view the kicker and holder and watch the ball placed on the ground.

Is that generally the way it is done?

My concern is you can leave a sideline exposed as the manual has you position your umpire toward the uncovered sideline.

What if you get a block and the ball goes toward that sideline?

Blue37 Thu Nov 08, 2007 12:15pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ed Hickland
Reading through five man mechanics for a field goal, you place two officials under the goal posts, one official on the line, umpire in the defensive backfield and referee in offensive backfield positioned to view the kicker and holder and watch the ball placed on the ground.

Is that generally the way it is done?

My concern is you can leave a sideline exposed as the manual has you position your umpire toward the uncovered sideline.

What if you get a block and the ball goes toward that sideline?

We have the R facing the holder and fairly wide. The wing official behind the R goes under. The U cheats to the side of the official who goes under. That puts both the R and the U on the uncovered side.

Additionally, if the play explodes, (block or bad snap), the wing underneath moves laterally along the endline until he reaches the sideline then moves up the sideline.

This seems to give us good coverage.

STEVED21 Thu Nov 08, 2007 01:46pm

Ed,

The picture in the last mechincs book is wrong. The L in the diagram should be under the goal post and the LJ on the line. The mechanic was changed last year but the diagram is wrong. The correct diagram can be found at NFHS.org under the football rules section. Look for the updated interpretations.

JugglingReferee Thu Nov 08, 2007 02:24pm

Canadian Mechanics
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Ed Hickland
Reading through five man mechanics for a field goal, you place two officials under the goal posts, one official on the line, umpire in the defensive backfield and referee in offensive backfield positioned to view the kicker and holder and watch the ball placed on the ground.

Is that generally the way it is done?

My concern is you can leave a sideline exposed as the manual has you position your umpire toward the uncovered sideline.

What if you get a block and the ball goes toward that sideline?

CANADIAN MECHANICS:

This is also the formation for 5-man FGA in Canada.

The R is supposed to go to wide side, but I prefer the short (empty) side to cover the sideline if needed.

MNBlue Thu Nov 08, 2007 03:22pm

I don't know when we missed the memo, but for FG coverage inside the 15, we have the BJ and the U on the posts. LJ and L on the line. R facing the holder.

Outside the 15, we have the BJ alone. U, LJ, and L in their normal positions, and R facing the holder.

dldsooner Thu Nov 08, 2007 04:34pm

:confused:
Quote:

Originally Posted by MNBlue
I don't know when we missed the memo, but for FG coverage inside the 15, we have the BJ and the U on the posts. LJ and L on the line. R facing the holder.

Outside the 15, we have the BJ alone. U, LJ, and L in their normal positions, and R facing the holder.

:confused:

How in the world can the BJ alone cover the goal posts by himself? You should never have just one person under the goal on a FG or PAT.

JugglingReferee Thu Nov 08, 2007 04:44pm

Canadian Mechanic
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by dldsooner
:confused: :confused:

How in the world can the BJ alone cover the goal posts by himself? You should never have just one person under the goal on a FG or PAT.

CANADIAN MECHANIC:

In our 4-man games, we have one guy under the posts. If close to the goal line (our uprights are on the goal line), the U can also go under.

In 12 years, I've only ever seen an issue come up twice.

With_Two_Flakes Thu Nov 08, 2007 09:21pm

Here in the UK, we have one man under the posts for the long FG attempts (we define "long" as 20yd line and beyond) and don't think it is a problem. You set up no more than 5yds behind the posts. Be ready to move quickly to the threatened post if the kick is to one side or the other.

JugglingReferee Thu Nov 08, 2007 10:07pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by With_Two_Flakes
Here in the UK, we have one man under the posts for the long FG attempts (we define "long" as 20yd line and beyond) and don't think it is a problem. You set up no more than 5yds behind the posts. Be ready to move quickly to the threatened post if the kick is to one side or the other.

Very well said 2Flakes! As soon as the kick goes, you can tell if an upright is threatened. If the posts are 6-7 yards wide, then at most you have to move is ~ 4 yards!

PSU213 Fri Nov 09, 2007 12:27pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by MNBlue
I don't know when we missed the memo, but for FG coverage inside the 15, we have the BJ and the U on the posts. LJ and L on the line. R facing the holder.

Outside the 15, we have the BJ alone. U, LJ, and L in their normal positions, and R facing the holder.

A situation happened in these parts at least 20 years ago. Team from the area (K) was playing a team from out of town (R). K is attemping a game winning FG. I don't know the specifics, but it was a fairly long attempt (by HS standards). It was well wide, but only the BJ was back there and he ruled it good. In his defense I don't know if he get confused about which post he was under or (not in his defense) he just didn't move to the post being threatened), but the R coach started saying 'homer' as you would expect and that he would "never come back up here for a game. Anyway, I'm not blaming the BJ for what happened, just saying that, in theory, it sounds good to only have one official back there for long kicks, just that it may not always work out for various reasons.

As a side note, the coach did bring his team back about 10 years ago and lost late in the game by an even worse call by the officials (which I can't defend in any way). Now I am pretty sure he will never be back in the area for another game.

ChickenOfNC Fri Nov 09, 2007 02:17pm

Until last week, we had at least one association here in NC that used only the BJ under the post for a kick, regardless of distance.

Last week, the state supervisor of officials ordered them to abandon that mechanic for the last regular season game and the playoffs, for obvious reasons.

The rest of the state uses BJ and LJ back on kicks, regardless of R's position.

Rick KY Fri Nov 09, 2007 03:31pm

Kentucky Mechanics:
LOS at or inside B15:
U and BJ under the post
LJ and L at normal wing positions
R with holder & kicker

LOS outside B15:
LJ and BJ under the post
U in normal position, cheating to LJ vacancy
HL in normal wing position
R with holder & kicker

U can protect the snapper from under the post on shorter kicks, and this leaves LJ in better position to rule on plays at the sideline/goal line if the kick goes bad or is a fake.

DJ_NV Fri Nov 09, 2007 04:30pm

Up until this year, we always had BJ and U under for Tries, regardless of distance and BJ/LJ under for all FGs. This year, we have changed our mechanics to have BJ and U under for all Tries and FGs regardless of distance.

The philosophy is that (in no particular order--they are all important):
1) there should always be two officials under the posts
2) The intersection of the GL/sideline pylon is extremely important and is uncovered on broken FG plays (which happens a lot in HS).
3) We do not allow our Us to subscribe to the stereotype that they are allowed to be less in shape than the rest of the crew. If an LJ has to bust *** 35 yards to get to the posts, then the U should be able to do it too. (I know that's asking a lot but it is what it is.... :) )
4) On FGs, count the number of times that you've had a close call at the GL/Sideline intersection compared to the number of times that Roughing the Snapper has been called.
5) The Referee now verbally warns the defensive linemen about RTS as well as the U
6) Most FGs in HS are not that long, therefore the U should still be able to rule on egregious offenders.

Are these philosophies perfect? Of course not, but there's going to be trade-offs in coverage in a 5-man crew no matter what, and so statistically this is what our association feels is best. so far so good....

Rich Fri Nov 09, 2007 07:23pm

We send one official back in 4-man only. The LJ is on the endline, wide. The R calls the uprights, the L has the kicker/holder for roughing and the U is in his normal spot.

We treat ANY placekick in 5-person one way:

R with kicker and holder facing the holder's face
U in normal U position (roughing the snapper, line play)
BJ under an upright
L/LJ under an upright with the "open wing" on the R's side

PSU213 Tue Nov 13, 2007 12:04am

Quote:

Originally Posted by RichMSN
We treat ANY placekick in 5-person one way:

R with kicker and holder facing the holder's face
U in normal U position (roughing the snapper, line play)
BJ under an upright
L/LJ under an upright with the "open wing" on the R's side


We do it the same here. Basically, if you, as a wing, are looking at the R's behind (not a pretty sight on our crew as I am sure is the case with just about everyone on here!) you are in the wrong place--that official should be under the post with the BJ.

Blue37 Wed Nov 14, 2007 01:30pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by RichMSN
We send one official back in 4-man only. The LJ is on the endline, wide. The R calls the uprights, the L has the kicker/holder for roughing and the U is in his normal spot.

Rich,

We do the same on short kicks (snap inside the 15) with one exception. The LJ does not go all the way to the endline. He can call under/over just fine from a couple of yards deep in the endzone. That gives him the opportunity to help cover his side on a fake/busted play.

If it is a longer kick (snap 15 or out), the LJ has the kick by himself. The R has roughing.

jaybird Wed Nov 14, 2007 08:26pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by RichMSN

We treat ANY placekick in 5-person one way:

R with kicker and holder facing the holder's face
U in normal U position (roughing the snapper, line play)
BJ under an upright
L/LJ under an upright with the "open wing" on the R's side

This is how we cover scoring kicks also. The State (OK) has told all our crews to use this mechanic.

bisonlj Wed Nov 14, 2007 10:05pm

We tried to use the new mechanic last year but having to remember which wing goes under the upright depending on both end of field and kicking leg of kicker created too many situations where we didn't get to the upright in time. It's easier to remember the LJ is the one who always goes back and the L can focus on the same thing for every kick.

Mechanics are designed to cover the most likely situations and make sure they are covered. I've been officiating for 8 years now and have had to bust to the sideline as a LJ a great total of TWICE. To adjust your mechanics to cover something that happens very rarely is a bad idea. I understand the philosophy of alternating which wing covers the goal post but it just didn't work for us.

Also, we have the BJ alone on field goals snapped from the 20 or farther out. He has plenty of time to get to a challenge goal post. This type of play is much more likely to have something crazy happen back at the line of scrimmage and having the LJ there can only help.

Warrenkicker Thu Nov 15, 2007 11:29am

Quote:

Originally Posted by bisonlj
We tried to use the new mechanic last year but having to remember which wing goes under the upright depending on both end of field and kicking leg of kicker created too many situations where we didn't get to the upright in time. It's easier to remember the LJ is the one who always goes back and the L can focus on the same thing for every kick....

Not to criticize your crew but someone is not recognizing the situation early enough if you are having problems moving to these positions. The only time we have ever had an issue was when R didn't recognize which foot the kicker was using so he was on the wrong side of the formation to begin with and when he noticed his problem there was not time to switch us back.

When we have a swinging gate formation we stay in the standard positions and then shift to the goal post when they shift into a standard kicking formation. There is more than enough time to do this if you see what is happening soon enough. Once you do this a few times it is easy to remember which way to shift.

Suudy Thu Nov 15, 2007 11:45am

Quote:

Originally Posted by dldsooner
:confused: :confused:

How in the world can the BJ alone cover the goal posts by himself? You should never have just one person under the goal on a FG or PAT.

I always thought in 5 man there are _always_ 2 under the uprights, even for long FG/PAT attempts.

However, for 4 man games, the U may be alone. On a short FG/PAT, LJ busts to the endline at the snap for over/under, R has left/right, HL has kicker/holder. For long FG/PAT, U has over/under, R has left/right, HL has kicker/holder, and LJ has the snapper. In neither of these cases does anybody have the goal on their own.


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