Misapp

MI Official · #1 (**permalink**) Sat Sep 23, 2006, 09:02am

okay we had a play last night, 4 and goal on the 3, called illegal substitution (live ball) on A. B, stopped the play, declined the penalty, and took over on downs. lightning delay before any play was ran. during the delay A coach brought to our attention that it should have been a dead ball penalty. contest was postponed until monday night. when we looked up the rule (NFHS)(4-7-3) it should have been a dead ball penalty. Here is the question:
A did not know the misapplication without the benefit of the delay, A had no more timeouts and probably would not have used rule(3-5-5c). Does my crew and I inform the coach of the error, is it a correctable error? should A have the ball 4 and goal from the 8? or do we resume the game and If the coach asks for the timeout to discuss misapplication grant it to him at that time? I am still in the dark as to why its a dead ball foul anyways... HELP!!

whitehat52 · #2 (**permalink**) Sat Sep 23, 2006, 10:16am

MI Official

You need to explain exactly what happened to cause the illegal substitution. Illegal Substitution could be a live ball or a dead ball foul. Without knowing what occured, it is impossible to say if you were correct or not.

MI Official · #3 (**permalink**) Sat Sep 23, 2006, 10:31am

What happened: a few players came in after Ready for play for a FG attempt....5 seconds later they went off to run an offensive play, violating rule 3-7-3. Ihad alwaysthought itwasn't actually a penalty until theball was snappedsince theplayershould have the chance to go backoff the field.

MJT · #4 (**permalink**) Sat Sep 23, 2006, 10:35am

whitehat52, while most IS penalties against A are dead ball fouls, I agree we do need more information to know if it should have been a LB or DB foul.

A second question is, does this qualify as the misapplication or misinterpretation of a rule? The 2 case book plays discuss spotting the ball in the wrong place after an incomplete pass, and the misapplication of a pass interference rule saying the ball was uncatchable. I am not sure that saying "your foul called should have been a DB, not a LB" is? I think it may be, but look forward to some others thought on my question.

MJT · #5 (**permalink**) Sat Sep 23, 2006, 10:43am

Quote:

Originally Posted by MI Official

What happened: a few players came in after Ready for play for a FG attempt....5 seconds later they went off to run an offensive play, violating rule 3-7-3. Ihad alwaysthought itwasn't actually a penalty until theball was snappedsince theplayershould have the chance to go backoff the field.

That is not how the rule reads. The rule states that a substituted player must leave the field immediately. 5 seconds for team A is too long, and most definitely if they start to get into a formation. In this case, it should be a DB foul. Since the ball did not yet become live after the questioned play, you could legally make a change IF that is truly a missinterpretation. I am going to do some looking in Reddings and see if it gives anymore knowledge to this type of play.

MI Official · #6 (**permalink**) Sat Sep 23, 2006, 10:51am

I was looking at 3-7-3 which states that during the same dead ball interval no substitute shall become aplayer and then withdraw and player shall withdraw and re-enter as a sub unless a penalty is accepted a deadball foul occurs a charged time-out or a period ends.

If you read this though the mere fact that they re-enter is a DB and thus they can come back in or withdraw if all they have is a 5 yard penalty, and in this case...actually go for a FG, instead of trying to see how the defense reacts. my $.02

cmathews · #7 (**permalink**) Mon Sep 25, 2006, 09:21am

MI I would say that if the coach requests and audience with the referee before the ball becomes live then you have reason to give it to him and change the ruling...it is just a longer dead ball period than we are used to LOL....however if he says he used video tape to justify his thoughts then get him with the USC as well...