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Ohioref3 Sun Apr 09, 2006 08:04am

Tax info
 
I was getting ready to do my taxes and was wondering what kind of writoffs I could take for my officiating. I do get a w2 in the mail and know that if you are self employed as an official that we can have some deductions and was wondering exactly what deductions I am entitled to.

ljudge Sun Apr 09, 2006 08:41am

One thing I'm sure of....If you're a member of NASO that's fully deductible. It says that right on the invoice you receive.

WhistlesAndStripes Sun Apr 09, 2006 10:04am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ohioref3
I was getting ready to do my taxes and was wondering what kind of writoffs I could take for my officiating. I do get a w2 in the mail and know that if you are self employed as an official that we can have some deductions and was wondering exactly what deductions I am entitled to.

Did you get a W-2, or was it actually a 1099?

TXMike Sun Apr 09, 2006 06:26pm

It is a business. You can deduct lots of stuff, i.e. mileage, meals, uniforms, clinic fees, training materials, etc etc etc. NASO does have a booklet on taxes for officials.

jrfath Mon Apr 10, 2006 08:15am

Also laundry, automobile depreciation. I believe it all goes in the Schedule C. If you use Tax Cut or something similar, answer all the questions about running your own business.

BktBallRef Mon Apr 10, 2006 12:06pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by jrfath
Also laundry, automobile depreciation. I believe it all goes in the Schedule C. If you use Tax Cut or something similar, answer all the questions about running your own business.

That's a slippery slope you're going down.

Do you do laundry at your house on a regular basis? I would think so. Therefore, you can't deduct the cost of laundry detergent, water and a washing machine, just because you wash your uniforms a couple of times a week.

To deduct automotive expenses, the vehicle must be used solely for said purpose. Do you use the vehicle for any other purpose? You can't even go to the store to buy a gallon of milk.

kentref Mon Apr 10, 2006 12:29pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by BktBallRef
That's a slippery slope you're going down.

Do you do laundry at your house on a regular basis? I would think so. Therefore, you can't deduct the cost of laundry detergent, water and a washing machine, just because you wash your uniforms a couple of times a week.

To deduct automotive expenses, the vehicle must be used solely for said purpose. Do you use the vehicle for any other purpose? You can't even go to the store to buy a gallon of milk.

Agreed.
I've never claimed auto expenses but I do claim a number of other expenses. A tax prep program like 'Turbo Tax' makes it pretty simple because it prompts you for the info. I keep track of my expenses throughout the year on a spreadsheet that is organized by the expense types in 'Turbo Tax' so all I need to do is plug in totals (into Turbo Tax) for a given expense type. It works well for me.

wisref2 Wed Apr 12, 2006 11:56pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by BktBallRef
That's a slippery slope you're going down.

Do you do laundry at your house on a regular basis? I would think so. Therefore, you can't deduct the cost of laundry detergent, water and a washing machine, just because you wash your uniforms a couple of times a week.

To deduct automotive expenses, the vehicle must be used solely for said purpose. Do you use the vehicle for any other purpose? You can't even go to the store to buy a gallon of milk.

As far as car expenses, you can deduct mileage if you do it properly. You don't have to use the car 100% for officiating. You do have to keep track of your mileage and there are some expenses you can write off that are prorated based on the percentage of business use. A good tax software makes it pretty easy.

BktBallRef Thu Apr 13, 2006 08:40am

Quote:

Originally Posted by wisref2
As far as car expenses, you can deduct mileage if you do it properly. You don't have to use the car 100% for officiating. You do have to keep track of your mileage and there are some expenses you can write off that are prorated based on the percentage of business use. A good tax software makes it pretty easy.

My reply was not concerning milelage. My reply was directed to the other poster's automobile depreciation deduction.

However, there's still confusion among many concerning mileage. For example, if you go to work, then drive to a game from work and then return home after the game, the IRS considers that to be part of a normal commute and that is not deductible.

Also, there's confusion among some concerning meals. You can't deduct a meal just because you were hungry and grabbed a Happy Meal on the way home after the game. You have to eat everyday whether you work a game or not. Just like going to lunch at your regualr job isn't deductible, neither is this. To deduct a meal, you would have to meet with someone (your assignor for example) regarding officiating, document the discussion and pay. Then you could deduct 50% of the meal.

insatty Thu Apr 20, 2006 04:28pm

All of the deductions referred to are reported on Schedule C, on which you will also report all of your officiating income. If you keep good records like I do regarding your deductions, you will probably have a net loss that will reduce your adjusted gross income. If you have too many losses over the years, you risk the IRS recharacterizing your officiating "business" as a hobby and disallowing any loss.

Dakota Fri Apr 21, 2006 10:30am

Quote:

Originally Posted by BktBallRef
For example, if you go to work, then drive to a game from work and then return home after the game, the IRS considers that to be part of a normal commute and that is not deductible.

Actually, it is the opposite.

The IRS does not allow commuting expenses from your house to your place of work, even if you are an independent contractor.

So, if you go home after your "day job", dress for the game, and then drive to the game, the second drive to the game is considered commuting to your place of work as an official.

OTOH, if you go directly from your day job work place to your officials job work place, that is considered transportation expenses, not commuting, and is deductable.

CAVEAT: I am not an attorney. The above is my opinion of the tax law only.

BktBallRef Sat Apr 22, 2006 10:23pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dakota
Actually, it is the opposite.

The IRS does not allow commuting expenses from your house to your place of work, even if you are an independent contractor.

So, if you go home after your "day job", dress for the game, and then drive to the game, the second drive to the game is considered commuting to your place of work as an official.

OTOH, if you go directly from your day job work place to your officials job work place, that is considered transportation expenses, not commuting, and is deductable.

CAVEAT: I am not an attorney. The above is my opinion of the tax law only.

Your opinion is incorrect, based on a post by a CPA on the Basketball board.

Tom.OH Sun Apr 23, 2006 03:36pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by insatty
All of the deductions referred to are reported on Schedule C, on which you will also report all of your officiating income. If you keep good records like I do regarding your deductions, you will probably have a net loss that will reduce your adjusted gross income. If you have too many losses over the years, you risk the IRS recharacterizing your officiating "business" as a hobby and disallowing any loss.


I have been a football official for 7 years and have never come close to having a "loss" in income. How do you offset so many game fees? I deduct dues (state and local), uniform and equipment costs etc. The IRS raising the mileage to $.485 per mile did help but I also paid more for fuel to drive to the games. I have read about others reporting losses on other boards but have not found out why or how.

By the way when are taxes due?:D

BktBallRef Sun Apr 23, 2006 04:51pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tom.OH
I have been a football official for 7 years and have never come close to having a "loss" in income. How do you offset so many game fees? I deduct dues (state and local), uniform and equipment costs etc. The IRS raising the mileage to $.485 per mile did help but I also paid more for fuel to drive to the games. I have read about others reporting losses on other boards but have not found out why or how.

Agreed. Must not work many games if you net a loss.

Dakota Mon Apr 24, 2006 11:01am

Quote:

Originally Posted by BktBallRef
Your opinion is incorrect, based on a post by a CPA on the Basketball board.

From the IRS. Who do you believe?
Quote:

Car Expenses
To take a business deduction for the use of your car, you must determine whether the use was business or personal.

If the answer is personal, no deduction is allowed. Personal use includes commuting – driving from your home to your regular place of work.

A deduction may be allowed if you have multiple jobs or businesses. Driving from your home to “business one” is commuting, but driving from “business one” directly to “business two” is deductible. Also, you are usually allowed to deduct transportation costs for going from your home to temporary workplace regardless of the distance.

Deductible car expenses can include the cost of 1) traveling from one workplace to another, 2) making business trips to visit customers or attend business meetings away from your regular workplace, 3) going to temporary workplaces.
http://eteamz.active.com/softballump...es/ded-car.jpg

parepat Mon Apr 24, 2006 11:59am

I also disagree with the prior statement that you must use your vehicle 100% for business in order to use the depreciation deduction. My understanding is that the vehicle must be used more than 50% for business in order to depreciate.

MJT Wed Apr 26, 2006 06:32pm

Now that is a good diagram Dakota, thanks!

BktBallRef Wed Apr 26, 2006 10:50pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dakota
From the IRS. Who do you believe?

I believe a CPA as opposed to some chart posted on an Internet discussion board! :)

Dakota Thu Apr 27, 2006 10:31am

Quote:

Originally Posted by BktBallRef
I believe a CPA as opposed to some chart posted on an Internet discussion board! :)

Some people are determined to be right even when they are wrong. You know this person is a CPA how? Weren't the people advising Enron CPAs?

Source of the information I posted:

IRS - Tracking Business and Travel Expenses

IRS Publication 463 Cat. No. 11081L Travel, Entertainment, Gift, and Car Expenses

Jim D Thu Apr 27, 2006 11:13am

Just as an example, last year I was able to claim about $610.00 for expenses. I had $178 in mileage, $170 in dues and subscriptions and $261 in equipment ( I bought a lot of new stuff).

STEVED21 Thu Apr 27, 2006 02:47pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dakota
Some people are determined to be right even when they are wrong. You know this person is a CPA how? Weren't the people advising Enron CPAs?

Source of the information I posted:

IRS - Tracking Business and Travel Expenses

IRS Publication 463 Cat. No. 11081L Travel, Entertainment, Gift, and Car Expenses

As a CPA, I can assure you that Dakota is 100% correct as it pertains to the auto expenses.

insatty Thu Apr 27, 2006 04:30pm

[QUOTE=Tom.OH]I have been a football official for 7 years and have never come close to having a "loss" in income. How do you offset so many game fees? I deduct dues (state and local), uniform and equipment costs etc. The IRS raising the mileage to $.485 per mile did help but I also paid more for fuel to drive to the games. I have read about others reporting losses on other boards but have not found out why or how.

Tom:

Keep good records for actual auto expenses, like gas, oil, repairs, interest, insurance and these become deductible to the extent of business use in addition to depreciation. Then you deduct your officiating-related meals and entertainment, travel expenses, cell phone, publications, camps and clinics, dry cleaning your uniform, business use of computer (Arbiter), officiating insurance, dues, road tolls, etc.

Download a Schedule C from the IRS website and keep records that pertain to the categories. Then say, for example, you have a $2,000 net loss at year's end. You will then effectively save the state and federal income taxes that you would have paid on that loss. So if you're in the 30% tax bracket, you would save $600 in taxes.

The Roamin' Umpire Fri Apr 28, 2006 03:59pm

Good lord, if officiating was costing me $2K per season, I wouldn't be doing it.

Then again, I suppose we have less travel here (NY Capital Region) than other places - there's one school 65 miles out from me and a handful of others over 30, but the vast majority of the schools I work are within 15 miles of home.

The Roamin' Umpire Fri Apr 28, 2006 04:02pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dakota
Some people are determined to be right even when they are wrong. You know this person is a CPA how? Weren't the people advising Enron CPAs?

Source of the information I posted:

IRS - Tracking Business and Travel Expenses

IRS Publication 463 Cat. No. 11081L Travel, Entertainment, Gift, and Car Expenses

Good of you to post your sources, but cut BktBallRef a little slack - as a friend of mine likes to point out, "The Internet knows everything, whether or not it's true."

BktBallRef Tue May 02, 2006 10:06pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by STEVED21
As a CPA, I can assure you that Dakota is 100% correct as it pertains to the auto expenses.

Well good, glad to hear it!!! Somebody else will be on here next week telling us something else. :)

BTW Dakota, no need to be an @ss. I was just going by what a respect member of another board had posted.

Dakota Wed May 03, 2006 11:55am

Quote:

Originally Posted by BktBallRef
Well good, glad to hear it!!! Somebody else will be on here next week telling us something else. :)

BTW Dakota, no need to be an @ss. I was just going by what a respect member of another board had posted.

I was responding to your comment about "some chart" being less believable than an (alleged) CPA who merely posted - posted his opinion. I gave the general source of the chart (IRS). I only posted the link for the google-impared.

CBrockett Wed May 03, 2006 12:34pm

Hey you CPA's out there... Looking for write-offs for the 2006 football season...

If i buy a $500 gold coin that I use in my youth league games for the coin toss, am I allowed to use that a business expense... and if I can.. would i be able to by multiple coins, one for youth, middles school games, high school games and collegiate games?

Just asking?

CBrockett

BktBallRef Wed May 03, 2006 01:37pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dakota
I was responding to your comment about "some chart" being less believable than an (alleged) CPA who merely posted - posted his opinion. I gave the general source of the chart (IRS). I only posted the link for the google-impared.

I know what you were responding to and as I said, there's no need to be an @ss. Notice there was a :) after the post that I wrote. I saw no such after yours.

TXMike Wed May 03, 2006 05:19pm

[QUOTE=insatty]
Quote:

Originally Posted by Tom.OH
I have been a football official for 7 years and have never come close to having a "loss" in income. How do you offset so many game fees? I deduct dues (state and local), uniform and equipment costs etc. The IRS raising the mileage to $.485 per mile did help but I also paid more for fuel to drive to the games. I have read about others reporting losses on other boards but have not found out why or how.

Tom:

Keep good records for actual auto expenses, like gas, oil, repairs, interest, insurance and these become deductible to the extent of business use in addition to depreciation. Then you deduct your officiating-related meals and entertainment, travel expenses, cell phone, publications, camps and clinics, dry cleaning your uniform, business use of computer (Arbiter), officiating insurance, dues, road tolls, etc.

Download a Schedule C from the IRS website and keep records that pertain to the categories. Then say, for example, you have a $2,000 net loss at year's end. You will then effectively save the state and federal income taxes that you would have paid on that loss. So if you're in the 30% tax bracket, you would save $600 in taxes.

I remember reading that you could only claim a loss for 3 years, after that they deem it not to be a business so you can no longer claim the loss

Bob M. Thu May 04, 2006 07:44am

REPLY: Mike...I've heard that too. But, don't they (the IRS) have to inform you that it's now considered a 'hobby?' You don't just stop claiming the deductions after three years, right?

TXMike Thu May 04, 2006 07:53am

Beats me. I never got to that point. Until last tax year I have been handling as a charitable contribution as my expenses were also in excess of income.

PADist1Ref Mon Feb 18, 2008 12:05pm

So the question here is: is the game site a Temporary place of work or a second job?

Jim D Mon Feb 18, 2008 12:12pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by PADist1Ref
So the question here is: is the game site a Temporary place of work or a second job?

I would say it's a second job. A temporary place of work would be where a site where my primary job would take me.

Forksref Mon Feb 18, 2008 12:51pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim D
I would say it's a second job. A temporary place of work would be where a site where my primary job would take me.

Seems to me to be temporary, since it is less than a year. My season lasts about 3 months.

Also, the last 2 summers I attended an officials' camp that was more than 300 miles away. With the mileage and gas and room and meals, it eats up a huge chunk of my revenue for the year.

MadCityRef Mon Feb 18, 2008 03:13pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Forksref
Seems to me to be temporary, since it is less than a year. My season lasts about 3 months.

Also, the last 2 summers I attended an officials' camp that was more than 300 miles away. With the mileage and gas and room and meals, it eats up a huge chunk of my revenue for the year.

Go with a Schedule C form and read the instructions for the list of deductions.
You can take some deductions you missed in the previous three years. Don't forget your Self Employment Tax!

Robert Goodman Tue Feb 19, 2008 04:32pm

[QUOTE=TXMike]
Quote:

Originally Posted by insatty
I remember reading that you could only claim a loss for 3 years, after that they deem it not to be a business so you can no longer claim the loss

No, the 3 years in a row of losses is only a guideline, as is that of profits in 3 out of every 5 years. If you can show you had a reasonable expectation of a chance of profit, you can still get sched C deductions. It is understood that some businesses are more speculative than others. For instance, if you'd had declining losses for 3 years and thought you'd become profitable the next, so you invested a lot in equipment (under the limit for expensing, which is huge) but then got laid up and couldn't officiate that year, that's a legitimate loss.

Also, if they're the sort of business expenses that nobody would consider supporting a hobby, such as fees to a licensing agency, they're legit too. I've taken schedule C losses for many years on an invention, and maybe had a slight profit just one or two years, but IRS understands that things like patent maintenance fees and legal fees are not going into a hobby!

Robert


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