Question:

How do you signal an incomplete pass? I have viewed many officials doing it one of two ways. One being with the finger tips of both hands meeting in the middle of the chest (illegal shift signal) and the other the "scissors" with the opposite hand extending outside the opposite shoulder. Whatin the forum's opinion is the most effective/correct for FED and NCCA?

"Signal 10 shows the "scissors" stile you've described and is the correct way for both NF and NCAA . It’s also the way I do it.

I've seen that illegal shift signal used once for incomplete in a game I worked. The experienced guy on the crew immediately went to that official and fixed it. It is wrong.

What you're calling "scissors" is the correct signal.

i agree that signal 10 shows the scissor style, but most college and nfl officials have adopted the illegal shift style. i think is because it looks more crisp. if you are being evaluated to college use the illegal shift motion. or least this has been my experience.

Another signal I don't see given correctly is for Delay of Game. Most give the "genie" signal.

Don't know where you got that information, but in my NCAA games, it's the scissor style all the way.
TV games I watch is the same. Can't say about NFL as I rarely watch them.

Unless my Ref is Barbara Eden, I despise the I dream of Gennie signal for delay. That being said, should they want it that way, then change the dang book to show it that way.

michaelpr - I think you're mistaken. I work exclusively NCAA rules, and can assure you that the mechanic you prescribe is wrong. I can't recall seeing it on Saturday on TV either.

I use the shift style. I think it looks crisper and have never been told differently from any of the officials that I've worked with or been evaluated by. I just don't like the look of the scissors.

That being said, I should probably switch to using the perceived correct signal.

Kind of like the touchback NFL style. I love seeing that in a HS game.

Unless you're in the SEC, and then you get to tack on an unnecessary "stop clock" signal.

Well if we are getting into this discussion about these signals I signal incomplete with the scissors style and not the illegal shift. However my BJ uses the illegal shift signal so I also use that under the uprights so that we look exactly the same and we look like syncronized swimmers because our arms are moving in sync.

I also use the genie signal for delay of game and I think that you also see that signal at all levels.

The one think I don't like seeing is the "I give up, don't shoot me" signal for touchdown. The signal is not palms forward with arms 30 degrees from straight up. Something like this.

(I don't have anything against this guy. I don't even know who he is.)

http://www.whscrusaders.cc/ATHLETICS...gnal093005.jpg

Lemme get that for ya Warren:

<img src="http://www.whscrusaders.cc/ATHLETICS/FBALL2005/images/king-refsTDSignal093005.jpg">
Holy crap that's huge...Not sure how to shrink it.

You don't have to use the stop clock signal after an incompletion? Everyone I've worked with has done it so I decided to do it too. Hmmm... good to know. I always felt akward going from the "scissors" to the "stop clock".

Oh and how exactly is the touchback signal in the book? don't have mine on me right now or I'd look myself.

NCAA/FED, Signal #7 from the chart, hand straight up and wave side to side. I believe NFL is hand extended straight out and wave up and down. This is what I did as LJ one time this year on a 4 man crew when I was covering a punt that became a TB. I was corrected by my WH, who loves to do just that every chance he gets. :D

Here is a link to page 1 of the signal chart on the NFHS Website:

http://www.nfhs.org/staticcontent/pd...gnal_chart.pdf

WOW! I read that before and my mind must have just translated it into what I've always seen on TV. The way it reads though it's almost a fair catch signal to signal a touchback.

I suppose that's one way to think of it, however, I have yet to see an official make a fair catch signal. :D

If you're in SEC territory, you may be expected to give that signal.

Nitpicking signals to this degree is ridiculous. Is it a crisp signal? Is it unmistakably the signal you intended to give? If so, WHO CARES?

And I'm an NFL touchback signal WH. Sue me.

I signal like the illegal shift and NFL touchback. I just think they both look better. That is just my opinion and I know it is not by the book.

Inc Pass signal for me is near a safe signal for baseball. Maybe not as robotic as the motion signal. If I have to sell the Inc Pass, it's the hard safe signal. Not for everyone but works for me.

Touch back is fair catch to me as well.

I have heard one guy explain how he was told to signal touchback. He was told to signal it just like he was stopping the clock with one arm. I though that was a pretty good description because all of us know how to stop the clock.

Illegal shift for me and FED touchback. I think the FED touchback is good for letting charging players know that the play is over and they need to stop. I had to use it three times last night as the kickoff went into the EZ 3 times.

One thing I try to correct though is sloppy incomplete signals. My BJ used to bend at the waist as if he was trying to sweep leaves on the ground. Whether it is scissors or shift, I want them to be crisp, i.e., two or even one wave of the arms, not any more and keep your arms extended with your hands straight for a second or two when you are done.

I call the touchdown signal above the "Roller Coaster". It looks like he is on the top of a hill ready to speed down and through a corner.

One thing that I personally think looks bad is when we hold our arms up for an extended length on incomplete passes. Like for a USC foul or something, just looks bad.

Something else, why would you give the stop the clock signal in addition to the incomplete signal? Do you do the same on touchdowns? Touchdown first then stop the clock? Just curious.

Good point, I don't do this but I know some people do. Incomplete is the signal which kills the clock so we don't need a stop the clock. As LJ I always give stop the clock on incomplete passes when I am not giving the incomplete pass. I think this makes it easier for the clock operator because I'm on his side. But I do think signaling incomplete then stop the clock looks dumb and its just redundant.

our high school mechanic is for officials not calling the incomplete pass to give the stop the clock signal. is is for the benefit of the clock operator who may not be in a position to see the incomplete pass signal.