Here is the formation, tight end is covered up by the wideout.

Tight end steps off the line and goes in motion,

False Start?
Shift?
Nothing?

Thanks

If the TE was in a 3 point stance, then you have a false start. If the TE is NOT in a 3 point stance and steps back and goes in motion without re setting as a back, he must be at least 5 yards behind the los at the snap. If he isn't at least 5 yds behind the los at the snap you have a live ball foul for illegal motion. If the TE steps back and resets as a back for at least 1 second and then goes in motion you have nothing. Remember you also must have the 7 or more on the los at the snap.

keystone, an end can get up once his hand is on the ground. Read rule 7-1-7a.

In this play, the TE ain't a TE. He's nothing more then a lineman since the wide receiver has "covered" him.

Did not notice he said he was covered up, he ain't a tight end then but I see now. My bad guys, will read more carefully next time.

End means end!

I had this same call two weeks ago. Single back, in three point takes a step forward (obviously missed the count). I toss the flag (LJ) and my white hat wasn't happy about it. He said "I saw that but its okay if he resets". I stuck with the story of "it looks like he was simulating the snap". While no defenders were drawn off side, I waited a second before tossing the flag to see if he completed the motion or if it was truely a blunder.

The more I think about it, the better I feel about my call. If we have two or three reciever to a side and the slot reciever comes out of his stance (obviously not shifting) not many people wouldn't hesitate to throw the flag. While technically he can reset, there is a common interperation of the rules that most players and coaches have come to accept as practice. Unless you are clearly shifting to a new postiotn, motion prior to the snap, once set, is illegal motion...procedue, whatever you want to call it.

The thing is, the coach yelled at the player for the foul that I called. Had I not called it, no doubt in my mind the other coach would have thought we missed a call. While its important to know the fine details of the rules, its also important to apply them in a way that is consistant with the way the game is and has been played for years.

REPLY: sloth...good for you. It was a false start. If you can tell he missed the count, then he must have done something that made it look like the play was beginning. Nothing good can come from letting that play continue. Shut it down! And tell your white hat that the old "He can reset" theory went out years ago. All he needs to do is watch any NCAA or NFL game on TV. Missing the count is consistently called a false start.

Let me start by saying I'm not in the "All movement by a back is ok because they can reset" camp. If they "simulate the beginning of the play", it's a false start. The play you describe sounds like a false start to me, and kudos for standing up to a referee who was improperly chastising you for blowing the whistle.

But ALL movement is not a false start either...

"Nothing good can come from letting that play continue"

I hate this thinking. If that is our motivation for stopping a play, why not stop it on EVERY penalty... after all, nothing good can happen after that, right? (Define "good", by the way, and tell me why we should be worried about whether something is good or bad)

I'm sure the defense feels that SEVERAL good things can happen after an illegal shift, and would disagree with your logic of depriving them of their right to decline a penalty and take the play.

If I'm the defense, PLENTY of good can happen if I let the play continue. Or we could have offsetting fouls, or....

I hate that line of thinking, too.

I agree with mcrowder. I too am not saying that all movement is okay.

Sloth does not indicate whether the white hat would have called illegal motion or an illegal shift on this particular play.
Taking away a chance for B to drop A for a loss, intercept, recover a fumble or even foul to get in a double foul situation is why everything is a false start is not a good thing.

If an A back fires and B reacts, kill it... false start.

This should all be worked out in the crew to get some type of consistency.

As I recall the fed has come out and said if that back "jumps" early as described above then they want a false start called. If he goes a little early and the snap happens then I would look at which way he went. If forward then motion. Sideways then nothing.

NCAA definitely wants a back "jumping" to be a FS, and I think the federation would agree. All I have heard in clinics and such I have been to is to shut it down.

<b>If he misses the snap count, his actions are definitely are simulating a snap cuz he thought that was the snap. It really is that simple.</b>

is this anything?
 

Being a new WH in lower level games(playing NFHS rules), I have heard differing opinions on this scenario. Players become set, back takes a step or 2 toward LOS then goes parallel to LOS in motion? I have heard false start, and also heard it is legal as he is not simulating snap, as its well before snap of ball. Thanks

Re: is this anything?
 

Varsity white hat here. This is no foul. Most teams send their backs in motion this way.