Another question for our newbies...
You've heard us say a few times that when you have illegal personal contact with an opponent, it is <b>not</b> unsportsmanlike conduct; it's a personal foul. USC must be non-contact in nature. Here's the question: <b>Do all personal fouls require contact with an opponent? If not, name some that don't.</b>

How long do we have to wait.

No, all personal fouls do not have to include contact with an opponent. Examples:

1) Hurdling
2) Unnecessary contact with an official


Speaking of item 2... 99.9% of the players when I am umpire are extremely polite (feigned or real) when asking me to move to give them the position they are looking for . Typically I bump into a few when backing up after RFP, and they excuse themselves, all politely. In a varsity game a few weeks ago, one kid surprised me by attempting to push (I am 6'3", 275 pounds so not an easy push) and saying "get out of my way". I just reminded him to be polite (his team was losing badly, running clock, etc). Is that a PF situation or did I do the appropriate thing? There were no other issues the rest of the night (b4 or after).

Not too long.

Hiding the ball under ones jersey is a PF.

Without my rulebook, I can only remember a couple.

1. Hiding ball under jersey

2. Throwing your helmet towards an opponent whether it hits him or not.

3. Use part of a team-mates body to gain an advantage (i.e. sitting/standing on a team mates shoulder or back.

I think these all are correct, but I'm sure I'll find out if I am wrong :)

[QUOTE]Originally posted by GBFBUmp
[B]No, all personal fouls do not have to include contact with an opponent. Examples:

1) Hurdling
2) Unnecessary contact with an official


You don't consider contact with an official a contact foul?

Don't forget ole 9-4-2k.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by SoGARef
[B]
Question included the "with an opponent" stipulation. I try not to consider myself an opponent of the players, although sometimes it feels that way when you are a wing :D The wording could be a FED exam question.

If you determined his push as an attempt to just get you out of his way I'd let it slide. If he was 'shoving' you or using profanity I'd flag it.

REPLY: Not quite till the <a href='http://www.smileycentral.com/?partner=ZSzeb008' target='_blank'><img src='http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/16/16_10_6.gif' alt='Cow 3' border=0></a><a href='http://www.smileycentral.com/?partner=ZSzeb008' target='_blank'><img src='http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/16/16_10_6.gif' alt='Cow 3' border=0></a> come home

Thanks, I think leaving it go was right then.

Gee Bob, the first to come to my mind (what's left of it) is swinging or kicking at an opponent whether you contact him or not.

Without looking at the answers:

The only one I can think of is a "Swing and a miss". We always say in our rules meeting that if you're gonna swing at a guy--you better hit him, cuz you're sittin out the game either way.

When is contact with an opponent an USC foul?

Saying never will usually get you in trouble. But in this case since I cant think of any contact un-sporty, and there’s none listed in the “Book”, I’m going to say never. Now how much trouble am I in?

I don't think you're in trouble, I can't think of any.

REPLY: Only a "little." Take a look at the penalty for intentional pass interference.

But Bob, the penalty listed for IPI only says to add an additional 15 yards from the succeeding spot. It makes no mention about unsportsmanlike conduct. I also remember having a discussion about this addition 15 yards and if we eject the player if he’d had a previous un-sportsmanlike. If I remember correctly the consensus was no. I believe the rational was although the enforcement of the additional 15 was treated like a UNS it couldn't be one because it was in fact a contact foul.

REPLY: Actually Jim, it <b>does</b> make reference to USC. It's a bit "hidden" but look at the PENALTY section and specifically look at the signal(s) for intentional PI. Agreed that it seems like a dumb decision to make it USC, but...

once again ... You are correct Sir !

Not so fast...
 

Actually, that signal also means "non-contact foul", not just USC... It can also apply to a five yard penalty... Just because that signal is used doesn't necessarily mean that you have USC...

Re: Not so fast...
 

Thank you for pointing that out--I love it when guys "talk" things out on here. S27 is also for nonplayer fouls.

The only thing I'd like to add that might be somewhat in opposition to your comment is that the book also implies that if you assess a penalty using S27 (USC/non-contact) that goes for 15 yards, someone should be tagged on your game card toward DQ.

On page 64 of the rulebook, under 9-8 PENALTY section, A second unsportsmanlike foul with a 15-yard penalty results in disqualification. I realize that you can split hairs and say that if it's not USC that you can't use that statement, but why would it say "USC with 15 yarder" if it didn't mean what I'm thinking--that if you use S27 and assess a 15 yarder it counts toward DQ. I believe the intent of that statement is because we do assess penalties using S27 that are only 5 yarders. But those are not USC, they're either nonplayer or noncontact (e.g. 1st sideline interfernce after an official sideline warning is S27 with a 5 yd. pen.).

What do you guys think?

Jonathan

LSU-AUBURN
 

LSU player jumped to block PAT, landed on an Auburn player. FJ ruled PF. Auburn gets another chance, PAT good, LSU goes home.

Coach Saban is confused, wants to know why it's a PF. He's on the NCAA Rules Committee, and he still doesn't inderstand that rule.

GO TULANE