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-   -   fumble into end zone (https://forum.officiating.com/football/10555-fumble-into-end-zone.html)

tball Fri Oct 24, 2003 11:22am

I have heard of this play happening twice in the past yr and I am baffled by the ruling by 2 varsity crews (NFHS):

-Player A in possession running towards goal line fumble ball at the two yard line. Ball rolls into end zone and out the backline or sideline w/ no additional touching or muff by either team. Both crews ruled touchdown-

Shouldn't this be a touchback?

jack015 Fri Oct 24, 2003 11:39am

As you have described the play, it would be a touchback. Is it possible that the covering official ruled that the ball, in posession of the runner, broke the plane of the endzone and was actually fumbled after it became dead? Hard to believe that 2 crews would miss that. What level are we talking about?

tball Fri Oct 24, 2003 11:45am

No,in one case, the umpire of the crew described the play to me and their ruling.

In the second game, two other officials that I know were at the game and saw the play. These were varsity games in both cases. In fact, the second situation occurred in a game that decided a conference championship for very large schools.

Our crew has talked about this in the past. The only thing that we can think of is that they are confused by another rule that states that if the ball is fumbled from the field of play and is unrecovered and untouched in the end zone by either team, it is ruled a TD. But when would that EVER happen?

WISREF Fri Oct 24, 2003 01:56pm

Thank you TBALL you always have such great questions. Clearly this is a touchback if the ball had not crossed the plane of the goal line.


Forksref Sat Oct 25, 2003 12:27am

tball

The rule of thumb: Any time a ball is fumbled through or out of the endzone including the sides, the defense will end up with the ball, either a safety or a touchback, depending on which way the play was going.

Sounds like someone needs to go back to the rule book and look at the definition of a touchdown.

mikesears Mon Oct 27, 2003 08:07am

Quote:

Originally posted by tball
Our crew has talked about this in the past. The only thing that we can think of is that they are confused by another rule that states that if the ball is fumbled from the field of play and is unrecovered and untouched in the end zone by either team, it is ruled a TD. But when would that EVER happen?
Backwards pass that both teams thought was forward that rolls (or was muffed) into the endzone. This would be one example.

tball Mon Oct 27, 2003 12:43pm

True-but in that scenario, it would be a safety. This brings another question; how long do you hold your whistle?

Ed Hickland Mon Oct 27, 2003 12:53pm

Quote:

Originally posted by tball
True-but in that scenario, it would be a safety. This brings another question; how long do you hold your whistle?
A Fundamental...whistle seldoms kills a play.

tball Mon Oct 27, 2003 12:57pm

True-so then we go back to the original statement that a ball would never lay in the end zone unrecovered!

JugglingReferee Mon Oct 27, 2003 01:03pm

It's interesting to hear the NF situtation.

Canadian rules dictate that the ball goes back to the offense at the spot of fumble.

Mike

Forksref Mon Oct 27, 2003 01:09pm

JUGGLING
 
Juggling.

I was watching a CFL game a week or so ago and I saw a ball fumbled, touch an offensive player and roll out of bounds. The officials gave it to the defense. Did I see this correctly? In the States, it remains with the offense.

mikesears Mon Oct 27, 2003 01:12pm

Quote:

Originally posted by tball
True-but in that scenario, it would be a safety. This brings another question; how long do you hold your whistle?
I was envisioning this on the other side of the field.

A7 throws a backward pass that hits A83 in the chest. It then hits the ground and rolls forward into B's endzone. Neither Team A or Team B makes a play on the ball.

Result: Touchdown for A.

JugglingReferee Tue Oct 28, 2003 08:50am

Re: JUGGLING
 
Quote:

Originally posted by Forksref
Juggling.

I was watching a CFL game a week or so ago and I saw a ball fumbled, touch an offensive player and roll out of bounds. The officials gave it to the defense. Did I see this correctly? In the States, it remains with the offense.

Hmm.... could be. I meant to qualify my response stating that the Cdn rules I'm talking about are the amateur rules, played across Canada, from PW to HS to Univ/College to Jr. and Sr.

I'm not sure of all the CFL rules yet. :)


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